Silk Road forums
Discussion => Silk Road discussion => Topic started by: oneiroi on April 13, 2013, 09:40 am
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Hi,
I know, many people, many threads about it has been posted. But I still don't understand why the hell SOME buyers don't finalize after their order is in their hands. I have 80% of such a cases. The last one bought 3 Virginia gold tobacco 50g each, with a registered shipping, domestic, and I know that he received this order. And what? Nothing. 6 days after, no response :(
OK, I can understand I don't know, cocaine users, heroine users, they just receiving stuff and ziuuuuuuu.......
But tobacco? What, is he dead? It is just simple 2 steps: log in, finalize.
Sorry, I had to...
it is so frustrating...
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In the name of buyers, only thing I can say is sorry. I think it's just a human nature. They are very excited and pressing, when there is a little bit of delay, but after receiving a parcel suddenly the problem seems to doesn't exist.
Personally, I always finalize when I open the envelope,, straight away, because it is, as you mentioned, fair and square. A vendor risking his life, do everything he can to please a buyer, so why not do the same...?
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I finalize the minute I open the package and confirm product. It's the right thing to do.
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I finalize the minute I open the package and confirm product. It's the right thing to do.
This! After all the hassle the seller goes to packagaing, printing, despatching, it's lazy and selfish not to finalize as soon as you receive.
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As a buyer, I don't understand this behavior and I've wondered about it for a while. I always finalize as soon as possible. With weed I usually finalize after the first few tokes, IF I'll be able to smoke that day. Otherwise, and with any product I'm not using THAT DAY, I finalize as soon as I open the package and weigh the product.
I have a few theories about auto-finalizers, but not much insight into which one(s) represent the most likely explanation:
1. Lazy Asshole Theory: Basically, I got mine so fuck everybody else. Autofinalizers can't be bothered once they get what they want.
2. Ignorance Theory: A lot of users seem to be clueless about how TOR, PGP, and bitcoin work, so it stands to reason that the basic protocols for buying and finalizing a purchase on SR might be a mystery to a lot of users as well. They might not know how to finalize, or might not understand that funds are only released from escrow when the buyer finalizes, instead mistaking finalization for a feedback process like eBay or Amazon.
3.Fear Theory: If the regular paranoid freakouts on the forums are any indication, the process of buying drugs on the internet causes some users substantial anxiety and stress. Fear causes people to act in irrational and unpredictable ways. Its entirely possible that for some users the whole process is enough of an ordeal that they try to avoid even thinking about SR and absent the motivation of drugs they can't be motivated to log in and complete the transaction. This avoidant behavior might resemble anxiety induced procrastination, with the subject themselves not entirely recognizing the root of the behavior and going to great lengths to not even think about SR because of the associated fears.
4. Punitive Theory: In the buyer's head, you did something wrong. The package didn't come fast enough. You didn't hold their hand through every aspect of the transaction. You took more than an hour to respond to their half-dozen 3am messages. Their SR transaction didn't meet their expectations in some way and they are going to punish you for it. American consumer culture encourages this attitude; the customer is always right and the provider of services (usually a cashier or clerk) is supposed to be submissive and bend over backward to please you.
5. Addict Theory: Once the product arrives, all other priorities go out the window and its off to the races. I actually doubt this accounts for many cases, as in my experience addicts are quite rational about the acquisition of their drugs and maintaining a steady supply, so it seems unlikely they'd want to piss off their dealer and damage their stats, thus making other dealers less likely to sell to them. Maybe some addicts who are particularly deep into the labyrinth will just shoot/snort/pipe up and forget the world immediately.
That's all I can think of. I really do think as a community we should start to try to understand this problem. If we can develop a "profile" of the autofinalizer, we might be able to come up with some remedies for the situation.
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You are justified in feeling this way. It takes a whole lot longer to make sure everyone stays "safe", than to simply log on and pay you. It really doesn't matter what drug or item it is, if you have it in your hands, you owe someone. Just be assured that not all customers are so self-consumed, and that is the great thing about being able to see how many times someone has AF'd. This goes with ANY online purchase I feel, not even SR in particular. The real kicker of it is how fast someone is to bitch or complain about it. That msg will be send out with haste.
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Hi,
I know, many people, many threads about it has been posted. But I still don't understand why the hell SOME buyers don't finalize after their order is in their hands. I have 80% of such a cases. The last one bought 3 Virginia gold tobacco 50g each, with a registered shipping, domestic, and I know that he received this order. And what? Nothing. 6 days after, no response :(
OK, I can understand I don't know, cocaine users, heroine users, they just receiving stuff and ziuuuuuuu.......
But tobacco? What, is he dead? It is just simple 2 steps: log in, finalize.
Sorry, I had to...
it is so frustrating...
I get this too... I had 3 domestic orders 3 weeks back, all over $1,000, all to different buyers which all went to auto-finalise. So frustrating. I've just added them to my blacklist and if they buy from me again they must FE. Because they didn't finalise, it delayed me cashing out and buying more stock, which disadvantaged other buyers.
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It's because the button says Auto-finalize.
So why not let it auto-finalize like it says?
The wording needs to change. It sounds like letting it auto finalize is what yu are suppose to do.
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It's because the button says Auto-finalize.
So why not let it auto-finalize like it says?
The wording needs to change. It sounds like letting it auto finalize is what yu are suppose to do.
I suppose I see where you are coming from. But, if someone takes an extra 9 days and lets the transaction AF, that in turn COULD put a vendor in the hole or make them rich. Depending on how they like to play this. The value of a BTC could change quite a bit in 9 days or 30 minutes for that matter.
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Fucking right dude. Letting it go is bad etiquette and it is mentioned in the rules so people should know. But they are high on drugs and probably also forget to pay their bills and feed their dog too.haha
I think what would really help is if you send buyers a reply when they order, that reminds them about these terms and conditions of sale. Just a friendly thanks for the order and please don't forget to press finalize or else your next order with us may be delayed. To avoid problems, please finalize. Thanks , The Team
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Well, I think I have heard of a few practicing this. Once they see that the parcel has been delivered, they msg the person themselves just to give them a heads up. I know that could get to be a bit much if there is a high volume of traffic, but it is a good thing imo. This needs to be a vendor/SR staff collaboration really. Because like you said, if someone is a drug starving junky (I hate using that term but what else?) gets their hands on some primo, the whole "ahh I will do it later" turns into a 3 day bender where they don't probably don't even bother feeding themselves, let alone anything else. INNOVATION, I have faith in these things getting changed around some and everything new needs to be fine tuned. 8)
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there's absolutely no excuse for it. I can only speak as a buyer, but I can see why so many vendors are asking for FE (which for me is a NO WAY IN HELL HAPPENING)...but again I understand why its come to this. The escrow system is pretty great assuming everyone does there part. For god sake, it takes 2 seconds, log in and finalize people...maybe the day will come when all this FE crap can no longer be justified and all the scammers are called out on their practices.
Cheers
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Well, I didn't know that there are much more people with the same problem... At least I'm not alone.
And +KARMA for all those good buyers who do finalize after receiving the item.
:)
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Seems like I've had better luck than most. I've only had 2 orders of 40 go to auto-finalize.
But my fellow vendors, remember: you can CHOOSE your buyers. If someone's stats show a history of auto-finalizing or too small a number of successful transactions, you have every right to cancel the order! A bit of a hassle, yes, but if it makes all that much difference to you, there are mechanisms in place to give you control.
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It's a ball ache, I've sent all my orders by tracked delivery, so I know they have the goods. Yet I am left waiting, no finalization, no response to my messages, and this is for nearly 7 orders. I've only just started on SL but getting paid is turning out to be a headache... There should be a solutions to this finalization scenario. I don't want to have to wait another 14 days cos people are too lazy to sign in and reply and I can see they've not even read the messages. It's rather inconsiderate.
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As a buyer, I don't understand this behavior and I've wondered about it for a while. I always finalize as soon as possible. With weed I usually finalize after the first few tokes, IF I'll be able to smoke that day. Otherwise, and with any product I'm not using THAT DAY, I finalize as soon as I open the package and weigh the product.
I have a few theories about auto-finalizers, but not much insight into which one(s) represent the most likely explanation:
1. Lazy Asshole Theory: Basically, I got mine so fuck everybody else. Autofinalizers can't be bothered once they get what they want.
2. Ignorance Theory: A lot of users seem to be clueless about how TOR, PGP, and bitcoin work, so it stands to reason that the basic protocols for buying and finalizing a purchase on SR might be a mystery to a lot of users as well. They might not know how to finalize, or might not understand that funds are only released from escrow when the buyer finalizes, instead mistaking finalization for a feedback process like eBay or Amazon.
3.Fear Theory: If the regular paranoid freakouts on the forums are any indication, the process of buying drugs on the internet causes some users substantial anxiety and stress. Fear causes people to act in irrational and unpredictable ways. Its entirely possible that for some users the whole process is enough of an ordeal that they try to avoid even thinking about SR and absent the motivation of drugs they can't be motivated to log in and complete the transaction. This avoidant behavior might resemble anxiety induced procrastination, with the subject themselves not entirely recognizing the root of the behavior and going to great lengths to not even think about SR because of the associated fears.
4. Punitive Theory: In the buyer's head, you did something wrong. The package didn't come fast enough. You didn't hold their hand through every aspect of the transaction. You took more than an hour to respond to their half-dozen 3am messages. Their SR transaction didn't meet their expectations in some way and they are going to punish you for it. American consumer culture encourages this attitude; the customer is always right and the provider of services (usually a cashier or clerk) is supposed to be submissive and bend over backward to please you.
5. Addict Theory: Once the product arrives, all other priorities go out the window and its off to the races. I actually doubt this accounts for many cases, as in my experience addicts are quite rational about the acquisition of their drugs and maintaining a steady supply, so it seems unlikely they'd want to piss off their dealer and damage their stats, thus making other dealers less likely to sell to them. Maybe some addicts who are particularly deep into the labyrinth will just shoot/snort/pipe up and forget the world immediately.
That's all I can think of. I really do think as a community we should start to try to understand this problem. If we can develop a "profile" of the autofinalizer, we might be able to come up with some remedies for the situation.
This is really good shit. Extra good.
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There's always going to be assholes who only care about themselves in this world.
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Just don't let that get you down though Sam. Being a new vendor is a very scary thing for customers (that doesn't excuse them not finalizing). But, what I mean is don't give up hope. If you stay consistent with your side of the transaction and try to "groom" each customer to the best of your abilities, then things should be OK. People tend to start coming back as repeat buyers if they enjoy the product and service. So the next time one of the asses who made you wait order, cancel! 8) As I said earlier, I think if someone can come up with a good innovative way to fix this, then it will be done.
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Agreed, I keep a shit list. I try and get the orders out as quickly as possible and expect transactions to be finalized on receipt. If people have an issue with quality/quantity that's what the feedback is for.
If someone decides they can't trip for a week or two and won't finalize till after the event then they won't be buying from me again.
:'(
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I think me and other vendors similar to me, let call us ants, who sell just small amounts, not making big money, just for upgrade standard of their live, or like me, disable (right hand numb, nobody wants to hire me - obvious reasons), or just unemployed because of global economy problems - those people get the arses spanking hard. Big vendors have got pages of pages orders so for them it is not much difference.
I know all truisms...
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Agree, pay immediately when you receive!
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There could be other factors that are preventing the customer from logging in to their account, computer could be broken, no electricity, in prison, death... the list goes on... don't write this person off if you don't know what really happened.
There's an old phrase: "Don't judge a book by its cover." - Although these days, most young people probably don't even know what a "book" is...
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Finalize once I can confirm the contents of the package are correct. Brief review of customer service, nondescript comment on stealth (good or bad), delivery time and such.
Update review once contents of the package have been tested.
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As a buyer, I don't understand this behavior and I've wondered about it for a while. I always finalize as soon as possible. With weed I usually finalize after the first few tokes, IF I'll be able to smoke that day. Otherwise, and with any product I'm not using THAT DAY, I finalize as soon as I open the package and weigh the product.
I have a few theories about auto-finalizers, but not much insight into which one(s) represent the most likely explanation:
1. Lazy Asshole Theory: Basically, I got mine so fuck everybody else. Autofinalizers can't be bothered once they get what they want.
2. Ignorance Theory: A lot of users seem to be clueless about how TOR, PGP, and bitcoin work, so it stands to reason that the basic protocols for buying and finalizing a purchase on SR might be a mystery to a lot of users as well. They might not know how to finalize, or might not understand that funds are only released from escrow when the buyer finalizes, instead mistaking finalization for a feedback process like eBay or Amazon.
3.Fear Theory: If the regular paranoid freakouts on the forums are any indication, the process of buying drugs on the internet causes some users substantial anxiety and stress. Fear causes people to act in irrational and unpredictable ways. Its entirely possible that for some users the whole process is enough of an ordeal that they try to avoid even thinking about SR and absent the motivation of drugs they can't be motivated to log in and complete the transaction. This avoidant behavior might resemble anxiety induced procrastination, with the subject themselves not entirely recognizing the root of the behavior and going to great lengths to not even think about SR because of the associated fears.
4. Punitive Theory: In the buyer's head, you did something wrong. The package didn't come fast enough. You didn't hold their hand through every aspect of the transaction. You took more than an hour to respond to their half-dozen 3am messages. Their SR transaction didn't meet their expectations in some way and they are going to punish you for it. American consumer culture encourages this attitude; the customer is always right and the provider of services (usually a cashier or clerk) is supposed to be submissive and bend over backward to please you.
5. Addict Theory: Once the product arrives, all other priorities go out the window and its off to the races. I actually doubt this accounts for many cases, as in my experience addicts are quite rational about the acquisition of their drugs and maintaining a steady supply, so it seems unlikely they'd want to piss off their dealer and damage their stats, thus making other dealers less likely to sell to them. Maybe some addicts who are particularly deep into the labyrinth will just shoot/snort/pipe up and forget the world immediately.
That's all I can think of. I really do think as a community we should start to try to understand this problem. If we can develop a "profile" of the autofinalizer, we might be able to come up with some remedies for the situation.
Great post!
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I think this quote from: strangeman should be pined on every sub-forum.
It is so true.
And sad.
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Whenever I have something arrive my first thought is to drop everything and finalize. It goes hand in hand. I would be losing sleep knowing I recieved and didn't pay. For me I wouldn't even take quality of product as a reason to not finalize. I'd just learn my lesson and move on.