Silk Road forums
Discussion => Philosophy, Economics and Justice => Topic started by: Pax on May 10, 2013, 06:21 am
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Why is LSD in the same schedule as drugs like Heroin, Meth and Crack(not cocaine). It is non-addictive it is less toxic than sugar and it has medical potential in curing alchoolism,deppression,cluster headaches (and possibly alot more if research was allowed to be done).So why does it have much harsher penalties then drugs like NO2,Morphine and Cocaine(not crack). I love how the US is coming around to Marijuana with a few states even legalizing it completly but even weed has its flaws it is modestly addictive(not nearly as much as some others listed above but still) and if smoked it does have some moderate(comparable to cigs) lung affects.What would be so bad about legalizing Psychedelics?(even just for medical use) why are these Psychedelic drugs that have so much potential treated like evil,toxic and dangerous garbage like heroin(no offense to the Heroin users I realized I may have layed it on a bit heavy there)
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because if everybody drops acid, the wool will be removed from their eyes and they can see through it all.
'they' have a charade to keep up, after all!
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'they' have a charade to keep up, after all!
Very precisely put !
Apparently, psychedelics are banned for political reasons, not for the safekeeping of potential users.
This pattern goes back even to times when shamans and witches were hunted down for not subdueing to the imperialists' official belief systems, e.g. native tribes in the Americas.
One more indication : Psychedelics are entirely hushed up in public media. (And if they are mentioned, usually with a slight sneer of ridicule.)
Even in Anti-Drug propaganda, they are barely discussed. The average reporters mention them only in second and third row after heroin, cocain, etc., as to draw as little as possible public attention to them.
(edit: grammar)
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because if everybody drops acid, the wool will be removed from their eyes and they can see through it all.
'they' have a charade to keep up, after all!
I thought that was common knowledge among SR.
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because if everybody drops acid, the wool will be removed from their eyes and they can see through it all.
'they' have a charade to keep up, after all!
I thought that was common knowledge among SR.
Unfortunately, this is OBVIOUSLY not the case.
He asked!
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I'm calling bullshit on the "if everybody dropped acid they'd see the truth."
All DEA scheduled drugs not sold by pharmaceutical companies are treated like heroin; there's nothing particularly special about the tryptamines that makes it so, save for that it once fueled a cultural war against the essence of America (warfare; and it's not to say that the drug itself induced anti-war ideals, but rather that those who supported acid all wished to rally around a singular issue; correlation ≠ causation)
As certain substances become more culturally acceptable (aka Pot) less heroin-like claims will be made on said substances as all users know that it's bullshit. Psychedelics still have a long time before they'll be legal, however.
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You're missing the reasoning behind why its illegal. It doesn't matter if it's physically "harmless", but because it makes people act completely insane. (The idiots with a weak mentality/idiots who take too much) Of course it isn't an issue with experienced users such as ourselves, but if it was legal, everybody would be going crazy in broad daylight...(especially women) 95% of the women I have given shrooms/lsd to, have completely flipped out. My ex gf took 2 grams and took her clothes off and poured water all over herself while repeating random nonsense.
As for medical purposes, maybe if someone can prove that they won't go out in public tripping balls...then yeah.
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You're missing the reasoning behind why its illegal. It doesn't matter if it's physically "harmless", but because it makes people act completely insane. (The idiots with a weak mentality/idiots who take too much) Of course it isn't an issue with experienced users such as ourselves, but if it was legal, everybody would be going crazy in broad daylight...(especially women) 95% of the women I have given shrooms/lsd to, have completely flipped out. My ex gf took 2 grams and took her clothes off and poured water all over herself while repeating random nonsense.
As for medical purposes, maybe if someone can prove that they won't go out in public tripping balls...then yeah.
That's pretty sexist. Perhaps you only have taste in bimbos?
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You're missing the reasoning behind why its illegal. It doesn't matter if it's physically "harmless", but because it makes people act completely insane. (The idiots with a weak mentality/idiots who take too much) Of course it isn't an issue with experienced users such as ourselves, but if it was legal, everybody would be going crazy in broad daylight...(especially women) 95% of the women I have given shrooms/lsd to, have completely flipped out. My ex gf took 2 grams and took her clothes off and poured water all over herself while repeating random nonsense.
As for medical purposes, maybe if someone can prove that they won't go out in public tripping balls...then yeah.
I imagined that - you should be able to get a drug license, when you prove you're responsible enough for it. now, I know this sounds like crazy government meddling and oversight, but I'm talking about an idealized system where the population doesn't constantly eye the government with severe mistrust.
The idea that the government can make it illegal for you, to put things you want into your body, seems kind of absurd. Like making sodomy illegal, because its icky to some people, who aren't even having it themselves. One day it'll just look so backwards - we'll realize how much big pharma had us, and our government (as well as its own anti-enlightenment agenda), by the balls.
Weed / mild euphorics won't require a license, anyone can use them.
Addictive / risky drugs (nicotine, powerful stimulants) will have a certain kind of "willpower" license, to make sure you don't become victimized by the industry behind them / your addiction. (To make sure that you remain in control of your life)
Hallucinogens will have a "keep it together" license, to show that you can handle hallucinogens while maintaining an understanding of reality / not just going nuts.
Or SOMETHING. I know this sounds like too much governance, but I think that the debate goes deeper than which drugs are "ok" and which aren't - because that will vary from person to person.
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@curiositymatrix-
It's not so much too 'big brother' as it is incredibly unfeasible to implement.
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because if everybody drops acid, the wool will be removed from their eyes and they can see through it all.
'they' have a charade to keep up, after all!
My thoughts exactly :)
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Here's the real question, why is CRACK (cocaine) and CRYSTAL METH listed as schedule 2 drugs and treated SAFER than LSD, mushrooms, and marijuana.
Dont belive it? look it up on the DEA website.
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Here's the real question, why is CRACK (cocaine) and CRYSTAL METH listed as schedule 2 drugs and treated SAFER than LSD, mushrooms, and marijuana.
Dont belive it? look it up on the DEA website.
yes that is the REAL ques. It is incredibly stupid, but around me it is a common saying that the first time you try acid, you know exactly why it is illegal. Crack has no medical or any practical use if i am correct, even coke is used medically, same with weed and i think Ketamine too.
The only way to see why it is illegal is to try it your self.
As for the 'tripping bimbos' most girls i've tripped with have freaked out in some way also, and usually its not pretty. So maybe it isnt sexist. Can men handle it better? Well, maybe but your first trip is kinda weird anyway and ive never tripped with a girl who freaked out when it wasn't her first trip. So maybe its a women + first trip= 'freak out'
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because drugs are bad... mKAy? 8) :o
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yes that is the REAL ques. It is incredibly stupid, but around me it is a common saying that the first time you try acid, you know exactly why it is illegal. Crack has no medical or any practical use if i am correct, even coke is used medically, same with weed and i think Ketamine too.
The only way to see why it is illegal is to try it your self.
But it's less obvious after you try! LSD and shrooms make me kind and caring, it helps me bond with other people and inclines me to be generous and forgiving. It was so incredibly hard to understand how anyone could have believe that it was something to be surpressed or demonized, as it was warm and gentle, no less rewarding for the stressed mind than sunlight is for the tired body. This is the only thing that can make me angry while tripping :(
I believe the illegality is based on two things:
1. Ignorance - probably the biggest reason is a lack of understanding. Neither politicians or police understand, nor want to understand it. Politicians have a priority to get reelected so researching the drugs and starting a debate about them in a propaganda saturated society will destabilize their support among co-politicians as well as the general populace.
2. Consumerism - Psychedelics makes you love the earth and the skies, it lets you find greater joy in giving away than recieving. It makes you creative and productive if you use it right - art and music flows from trippin' heads like water from glaciers. Less need for artificial joy/entertainment will lead to an intense decrease in consumption of mass media, and probably many electronic devices. I believe people would be more do-it-yourself inclined, making their own furniture, growing their own food. I also believe a lot of people would turn to vegetarianism which would be devastating for the farming industry (grotesque amounts of money and crops go into the systematic breeding and slaughtering of animals).
A psychedelic revolution (a world where a high percentage tries LSD/shrooms/whatever) can not go hand in hand with the current modes of government. There is way to much brushing problems aside, trying to distract the public from problems with cheap jokes and bland entertainment. How can they possibly stay in power if so much resentment was generated towards them? That's why they are struggling to call us crazy, and we need to show the people around us how staggeringly sane and clear-sighted we are.
Sorry for the rant. I hate the government :) lol
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because if everybody drops acid, the wool will be removed from their eyes and they can see through it all.
'they' have a charade to keep up, after all!
I thought that was common knowledge among SR.
Unfortunately, this is OBVIOUSLY not the case.
He asked!
Something can still be 'common knowledge' if once and a while someone doesn't know it. Example every single person knows a particular fact except one person does not, still common. An exaggeration but just an example.
blah blah blah...semantics, but anyway
i am certainly in support of a "psychedelic revolution" it won't happen in this life time, but i sure as hell support it!
P.S. Can someone on these forums run for office?!
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The reason drug policies haven't been liberalized is because it's politically useful to create moral panics which translate directly into votes and because it's good training for police state tactics. As why psychedelics are in the worse schedule, I do think it's because they pose the most threat to established socio-economic order; consumerism, greed, militarism, worship of wealth, acceptance of poverty, exploitation and degradation as inevitable & morally justifiable in this day & age.
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because if everybody drops acid, the wool will be removed from their eyes and they can see through it all.
'they' have a charade to keep up, after all!
I thought that was common knowledge among SR.
Unfortunately, this is OBVIOUSLY not the case.
He asked!
Something can still be 'common knowledge' if once and a while someone doesn't know it. Example every single person knows a particular fact except one person does not, still common. An exaggeration but just an example.
blah blah blah...semantics, but anyway
i am certainly in support of a "psychedelic revolution" it won't happen in this life time, but i sure as hell support it!
P.S. Can someone on these forums run for office?!
A) i assume nobody knows anything. personally, i don't know dick. psychedelics have taught me that much.
B) yes.
C) please?
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In my opinion they are treated like that because the boss says so. Whatever the boss says the slaves will go enforce.
I believe there is a need for police officers, but god damn. All they do is follow orders, a lot of them being unjust.
I understand people have free will, and I would hope if they were ordered to do something morally wrong they would protest that order.
But hell, the Nazi's were just following orders. :o
Libertarian and proud*
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Libertarian and proud*
Is it just me or is the libertarian ideology a pussified, suit-and-tied version of Anarchy for those too afraid to call themselves anarchists?
Regardless, look up the Milgram experiment as well as the Asch conformity experiment to see why police and Nazis just followed orders.
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Is it just me or is the libertarian ideology a pussified, suit-and-tied version of Anarchy for those too afraid to call themselves anarchists?
it is pseudo anarchism. they just want to privatise the State. real anarchists want to abolish it.
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Libertarian and proud*
Is it just me or is the libertarian ideology a pussified, suit-and-tied version of Anarchy for those too afraid to call themselves anarchists?
Regardless, look up the Milgram experiment as well as the Asch conformity experiment to see why police and Nazis just followed orders.
I am not afraid to call myself an anarchist, it's just that the general public doesn't know the true definition of anarchy.
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Libertarian and proud*
Is it just me or is the libertarian ideology a pussified, suit-and-tied version of Anarchy for those too afraid to call themselves anarchists?
Regardless, look up the Milgram experiment as well as the Asch conformity experiment to see why police and Nazis just followed orders.
I am not afraid to call myself an anarchist, it's just that the general public doesn't know the true definition of anarchy.
the true definition of anarchism excludes capitalism and therefore excludes libertarianism, as a matter of definition
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yes that is the REAL ques. It is incredibly stupid, but around me it is a common saying that the first time you try acid, you know exactly why it is illegal. Crack has no medical or any practical use if i am correct, even coke is used medically, same with weed and i think Ketamine too.
The only way to see why it is illegal is to try it your self.
But it's less obvious after you try! LSD and shrooms make me kind and caring, it helps me bond with other people and inclines me to be generous and forgiving. It was so incredibly hard to understand how anyone could have believe that it was something to be surpressed or demonized, as it was warm and gentle, no less rewarding for the stressed mind than sunlight is for the tired body. This is the only thing that can make me angry while tripping :(
I believe the illegality is based on two things:
1. Ignorance - probably the biggest reason is a lack of understanding. Neither politicians or police understand, nor want to understand it. Politicians have a priority to get reelected so researching the drugs and starting a debate about them in a propaganda saturated society will destabilize their support among co-politicians as well as the general populace.
2. Consumerism - Psychedelics makes you love the earth and the skies, it lets you find greater joy in giving away than recieving. It makes you creative and productive if you use it right - art and music flows from trippin' heads like water from glaciers. Less need for artificial joy/entertainment will lead to an intense decrease in consumption of mass media, and probably many electronic devices. I believe people would be more do-it-yourself inclined, making their own furniture, growing their own food. I also believe a lot of people would turn to vegetarianism which would be devastating for the farming industry (grotesque amounts of money and crops go into the systematic breeding and slaughtering of animals).
A psychedelic revolution (a world where a high percentage tries LSD/shrooms/whatever) can not go hand in hand with the current modes of government. There is way to much brushing problems aside, trying to distract the public from problems with cheap jokes and bland entertainment. How can they possibly stay in power if so much resentment was generated towards them? That's why they are struggling to call us crazy, and we need to show the people around us how staggeringly sane and clear-sighted we are.
Sorry for the rant. I hate the government :) lol
That was No rant!!
That's the truth that must not be told!!
Point number 2 was just spot on. It is a change that wouldnt work with todays society yes, but its a change that we need to make work. Otherwise there will be no resources left to live. Were expanding and expanding and just killing our mother earth yeah call me a hippie but goddamn I want the human race to be able to live 10,000 more years not just 100
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I think technocracy and anarcho-syndicalism are also very interesting ideologies. Anarchism might be a bit hardcore for most people, but it might work. There are so many better ways of running the world than using this oligarchic indirect "democracy".
ThisSHITScrazyman: Hippies are wonderful :)
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Look for the talk by Alan Watts titled The Alchemy of LSD.
He explained it very well. The reasons are irrational, sometimes even occult.
But i think if you drop acid you will grasp the whole picture yourself..
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I think technocracy and anarcho-syndicalism are also very interesting ideologies. Anarchism might be a bit hardcore for most people, but it might work. There are so many better ways of running the world than using this oligarchic indirect "democracy".
ThisSHITScrazyman: Hippies are wonderful :)
technocracy is a garbage ideology that would result in tyranny
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Apparently, psychedelics are banned for political reasons, not for the safekeeping of potential users.
This pattern goes back even to times when shamans and witches were hunted down for not subdueing to the imperialists' official belief systems, e.g. native tribes in the Americas.
Couldn't be more true!
The Amazon Forest of Central America has been the home of hundreds and hundreds of different species of plants that contain hallucinogenic properties. These have been used for centuries by native tribes living in the forest for ceremonial and ritual use. Many anthropologists have written books on this subject, if not only for the miraculous ways the indigenous peoples knew who to properly recognize the plants and use them in a way that extracted their potency. When colonialists began to settle in, they discovered the plants and their usage, leading them to condemning the activities and seeking out the plants with the purpose of extinction.
Apparently, for people who wish to stay in power by have dominion over others, substances that allow individuals to explore a state of consciousness where their discoveries are uncontrollable is a big no-no.
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P.S. Can someone on these forums run for office?!
[/quote] Yes Please I would second that motion and even help volunteer and organize some rallys or campaigns (pretty much anything I could to help)
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It is incredibly stupid, but around me it is a common saying that the first time you try acid, you know exactly why it is illegal.
This is actually quite funny because I can recall saying at least a few times while tripping on acid, speaking from my conditioned subconscious of the laws that have been created against drugs, that "it seems like feeling this good would be illegal" and then I remember and say to myself "oh wait it is".
It's a very simplified opinion but I really believe most of the drugs (especially psychedelics) are illegal because those people that make the laws secretly just want to keep them for themselves. Probably believe it should only be obtained by a select few and due to them being able to actually make the rules, they attempted to make that so but they underestimated the length's that the people will go to seek out the things that we desire.
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Because they all fall under their umbrella of detrimental substances of no medical value. The counter-culture movement didn't really help things either.
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The counter-culture movement...
This is not counter-culture, this is emerging true culture..
The point is not in confronting anything but integrating and evolving..
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Wow... think of a terrorist attack that not only involved explosives, but aerosols of Meth, LSD, DMT, and Psilocin. Fucking righteous!
Who cares how they are "treated". Illegal means illegal, and getting caught means you're a fuck up.
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The culture that embraced LSD was seen as a threat to elite power, as a result of a failing education (indoctrination) system. Having higher prison sentences for crack vs. cocaine is a way to lock up a (largely black) underclass who are no longer useful to the economy (since the decline in manufacturing). I recommend everyone watch The House I Live In. It has some excellent monologues from David Simon who wrote The Wire.
http://skylo.me/vv.php?Id=62a19bb81f52a7a0ffd8ec814fc7e5a3 (I know this link looks weird. Just google "watch the house i live in" if you don't want to use that one)
Getting caught may well mean that you fucked up, but many other factors are equally or even more important. Factors such as race and class.