Silk Road forums
Discussion => Drug safety => Topic started by: avast on December 24, 2012, 01:10 am
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After recently quitting opiates I've been going through withdrawal for the past few days now. Besides the normal shitty cravings I have unable to sleep at all of the past 72 hours. I have a stockpile of benzos (Xanax, Valium and Klonopin) and have been trying to use them but still running into problems. I prefer to use Valium. 2 days ago I took 5mg Valium about an hour before going to bed without success. Last night I took 10 mg Valium a little more than 2 hours before without success.
My question to the community is how much can I (or rather should I) take in order to safely fall asleep and stay asleep for the entire night?
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Valium isn't really the benzo of choice when you want to fall asleep. It has a very long half life (several days including metabolites), so it will not clear your system during the night, preventing using effective doses that make you fall asleep, but not keep you feeling sleepy through the next day.
The xanax you have may be more effective at this with a half life of about 6 hours. A 2 mg dose would probably be pretty sleep inducing when you're not very resistant to benzo's, but that effect will fade due to tolerance quite quickly. Also, xanax is more anxiolytic than hypnotic, making it not the best substance to choose.
I suppose the best benzo for your issue would be something like nitrazepam (mogadon) that combines a short halflife with mostly hypnotic effects.
Alternatively you could go for another class of substances: First generation antihistamines like benadryl are pretty effective at 50 - 100 mg doses for inducing sleep, especially in combination with a moderate amount of alcohol (2 to 3 drinks or so). Like combining benzo's with alcohol this may lead to some anterograde amnesia though, so it would be best to do this at home, and don't do any important work after ingesting the combination.
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Insomnia is my department actually. You need a hypnotic. I have several ranging from promethazine, seroquel, soma, nitrazepam, zopiclone, zolpidem, etizolam and possibly more "exotic hypnotics" i.e temazepam, triazolam, midazolam coming soon.
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The xanax you have may be more effective at this with a half life of about 6 hours. A 2 mg dose would probably be pretty sleep inducing when you're not very resistant to benzo's, but that effect will fade due to tolerance quite quickly. Also, xanax is more anxiolytic than hypnotic, making it not the best substance to choose.
From my experience Xanax does knock me out, but I just can't stay asleep. The length is about 4 hours at the most. I really need 8 hours a night if not more. I think I have mirtazapine somewhere if that is a hypnotic I might try that.
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Have you ever tried a solution like benadryl?
In terms of half life it matches nicely with a 'good night of sleep'.
Personally i only have problems falling asleep, once solidly asleep i'll usually stay that way until an alarm clock or something similarly unpleasant wakes me up. If you have no problem falling asleep but just maintaining sleep, i reckon the best approach would be different.
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Bromazepam + indica weed/strong hash works best for me to come down from all speedy stuff. Don't know about opiates withdrawal.
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About hypnotics- I tried taking temazepam for a week and it still took me hours to get to sleep, if I slept at all. I guess it depends on what parts of your brain need the stimulation for sleep, you might have to try a few different things before you find what's right for you.
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zolpidem works wonders for me but you wake up after 4 hours and have to redose. thats 10 mg pills. or IV/IM diazepam should knock you out or IV midazolam .
Edit:
Sorry did not read the whole question just title: well if you have diazepam, alprazolam, clonazepam sorry to say this but you wont sleep. maybe 2-4 hours max. just keep taking clonazepam until you fall asleep. but after an hour or two you will wake up kinda panicking and won;t be able to fall asleep again. atleast it's how it is for me one time i wake up panicking and called and ambulance asking to inject diazepam because i can't fall asleep.
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Seriquil will knock your dick in the dirt... OP iv been where u are as far as Opiate WD and i never could sleep even when taken Xanax and Kpins, it helps and is better than nothing but when u go through Opiate with drawl and its from long time use its something u end up being awake from for 72hrs and then u may fall asleep a few hrs here and there but it takes a LOOONG TIME to get on track.. I feel for u man.. Im on Methadone now for my Opiate addiction, I would suggest u try to find a couple methadones to get u through the first week or so.. Iv been on Opiates over 10 years and have been through WD many many times.. Your gonna need more than a few valium to knock u out.. Try letting the Xanax desolve under your tounge but you need BOUT 6mg at this stage..Thats of xanax, Valium i wouldnt even be using since u have stronger better Benzos.. The Kpins an Xanax are about the best Benzo there is, Now like Bruce said Seiquil is not a benzo but it will knock u down hard !
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Every time I take temazepam for sleep, I end up enjoying myself a little too much and stay up pretty late, and sleep in. Then I wake up tired with a temazepam hangover and have usually done something retarded like eat sandwiches in my sleep.
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For opiate wd you can try some neurontin or clonidine. They won't put a big smile on your face but it will help. Take immodium for the shits. For sleep, kpins are the longest lasting and should keep you going all night. Don't trade an opiate habit for a benzo habit. After you start feeling a little better switch to an antihistamine or a sleepy antidepressant like trazodone. Or even seroquel. Start with 25 mg seroquel and it will make you sleep, a long time too.
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Every time I take temazepam for sleep, I end up enjoying myself a little too much and stay up pretty late, and sleep in. Then I wake up tired with a temazepam hangover and have usually done something retarded like eat sandwiches in my sleep.
Temazepam is pretty odd in that regard, especially when combined with even very moderate amounts of alcohol. From personal experience i can confirm it is a benzo that causes memory loss quite easily, much more so then xanax or valium at comparable doses. Ending up doing something silly/stupid sounds familiar too, despite not actually recalling any of that.
If the only goal is to get a couple of hours of decent sleep, oxazepam may be an interesting option. Many people consider it an inferior benzo, but thats mainly because of the large doses need tot get an equal effect to that of valium. You need to take 2 or 3 times more for the same sedative effect, but it will metabolize much faster, leaving you feeling less drowsy the next day. Also, at least for me, it causes less memory loss compared to temazepam or diazepam, which i think is often a good thing.
I don't take oxazepam at home, but ive found it to be a very good drug to take on long haul flights. A 50 to 100 mg dose is enough to knock me out in combination with a few drinks, yet i awaken quite functioning okay once landed at the other end. I should point out that i have no fear of flying whatsoever though, so i do not require any anxiolytic effect from it, just the hypnotic part. Taking the equivalent dose of xanax (say 3 mg or so) would so work just fine, but somehow that seems to wear off a bit slower leaving me a bit dazed (though still in full control) the morning after.
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Every time I take temazepam for sleep, I end up enjoying myself a little too much and stay up pretty late, and sleep in. Then I wake up tired with a temazepam hangover and have usually done something retarded like eat sandwiches in my sleep.
Temazepam is pretty odd in that regard, especially when combined with even very moderate amounts of alcohol. From personal experience i can confirm it is a benzo that causes memory loss quite easily, much more so then xanax or valium at comparable doses. Ending up doing something silly/stupid sounds familiar too, despite not actually recalling any of that.
If the only goal is to get a couple of hours of decent sleep, oxazepam may be an interesting option. Many people consider it an inferior benzo, but thats mainly because of the large doses need tot get an equal effect to that of valium. You need to take 2 or 3 times more for the same sedative effect, but it will metabolize much faster, leaving you feeling less drowsy the next day. Also, at least for me, it causes less memory loss compared to temazepam or diazepam, which i think is often a good thing.
I don't take oxazepam at home, but ive found it to be a very good drug to take on long haul flights. A 50 to 100 mg dose is enough to knock me out in combination with a few drinks, yet i awaken quite functioning okay once landed at the other end. I should point out that i have no fear of flying whatsoever though, so i do not require any anxiolytic effect from it, just the hypnotic part. Taking the equivalent dose of xanax (say 3 mg or so) would so work just fine, but somehow that seems to wear off a bit slower leaving me a bit dazed (though still in full control) the morning after.
Oxazepam is pretty uncommon in the US. I've never had it, or bromazepam.
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I know, its mostly a western European prescribed drug.
Oxazepam is short acting benzodiazpine with pretty broad spectrum effects - both sedative and anxiolytic. I suppose the equivalent dose compared to something like xanax is rather high: 1 mg of xanax is as effective as 10 to 50 mg of oxazepam, depending on the use.
Oxazepam is a bit more hypnotic compared to xanax at equivalent dosages though, but not as much as nitrazepam. The main reason to prescribe oxazepam should be problems falling asleep due to anxiety/panic related problems. It is prescribed for a wide array of problems though, sometimes not being the best fit for the problem at hand.
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I strangely got to get some bromazepam shortly after posting, so yeah I like bromazepam.
:)