Silk Road forums

Discussion => Shipping => Topic started by: Lightbulb-breaking on September 18, 2012, 01:56 am

Title: We should take *Stealth Shipping* into discourse, or Redefining Stealth Shipping
Post by: Lightbulb-breaking on September 18, 2012, 01:56 am
I have noticed that every vendor on the SR makes lofty claims about their 100% SUPER STEALTH SHIPPING and the like, only to receive the package and have it be a folded piece of paper with a vacuum sealed present inside. Now I realize its simply good business to advocate your packaging because no one in their right mind is going to go on SCHEDULE 1- FREE MEDIOCRE SHIPPING PRACTICES, so I find it difficult to blame the vendors being the peddlers of many fine wares that they are. Honesty would be great, but it simply cant be expected.

The burden of blame then falls on we, the buyers. Too many times have I watched the buyer reviews and seen "5/5 Extreme stealth. Great product, whatever" only for the truth to be told by my package, which tells a different tale of rather shoddy and concerning packaging job. What I am trying to say is greater accountability should felt by the buyer in acknowledging the extent to wish they impact other buyer's purchasing decisions, especially in the realm of packaging where a false review of stealth could mean a fellow buyer is approached by LE. Furthermore, if buyers wont improve packaging on their own do what you can to deride their poor packaging as a service to your own safety and the safety of your fellows. This way sellers with trustworthy packaging will rise to the top, lower prices, and an economic incentive will be created for those sellers with bad packaging practices to improve their packaging.

Let us take packaging, arguably the most important aspect of the silk road, into discourse. Let us redefine Stealth Shipping.
Auf Wiedersehen.
Title: Re: We should take *Stealth Shipping* into discourse, or Redefining Stealth Shipping
Post by: vladmir on September 18, 2012, 02:08 am
Hello,

Offer some advice for vendors :-). Removed :-)
Title: Re: We should take *Stealth Shipping* into discourse, or Redefining Stealth Shipping
Post by: Lightbulb-breaking on September 18, 2012, 02:57 am
Good call. I think what we need is to develop the language of the silkroad. What do we, the buyers and reviewers, mean when we say good packaging? As it stands, many claims made regarding packaging have been inconsistent and the terms have lost their meaning.
Title: Re: We should take *Stealth Shipping* into discourse, or Redefining Stealth Shipping
Post by: LetGoOfYourEgo on September 18, 2012, 03:12 am
Proper shipping is a skill that is acquired from the mistakes you make. I'm lucky in that I've spent half my life fucking up and making adjustments in the "legal" merchandise trade in order to make sure things arrive safe and sound.

One problem is people who've never shipped anything in a commercial sense before start out doing it with illegal things here, so they're bound to make a few fuck ups that can endanger people's lives instead of just ruined merchandise and a having to refund or reship.

Another problem is that you *don't* want random people here to know how you personally are packaging and sending items, so trying to provide some advice in this department can really put you at risk.

For instance, I know how to package an item using special materials and methods to make it  99.9% safe against any kind of "sniff" test (human/canine/machine) and electronic imaging examination. Would I ever disclose this information? Only if I was done selling on SR, and the PDF instructions would cost you $1k...
Title: Re: We should take *Stealth Shipping* into discourse, or Redefining Stealth Shipping
Post by: vladmir on September 18, 2012, 03:21 am
you should work for the cartel why are you wasting your time on silk road!
Title: Re: We should take *Stealth Shipping* into discourse, or Redefining Stealth Shipping
Post by: LetGoOfYourEgo on September 18, 2012, 03:31 am
you should work for the cartel why are you wasting your time on silk road!

I'm sure there's some using it, which is why lots of drugs get to their destinations.

I wouldn't think it's good for my want to continue living and breathing to instruct a large drug business on the exact methods. Why would they need me afterwards? lol
Title: Re: We should take *Stealth Shipping* into discourse, or Redefining Stealth Shipping
Post by: vladmir on September 18, 2012, 03:36 am
you should work for the cartel why are you wasting your time on silk road!

I'm sure there's some using it, which is why lots of drugs get to their destinations.

I wouldn't think it's good for my want to continue living and breathing to instruct a large drug business on the exact methods. Why would they need me afterwards? lol

I was attempting to have competition removed :-)
Title: Re: We should take *Stealth Shipping* into discourse, or Redefining Stealth Shipping
Post by: LetGoOfYourEgo on September 18, 2012, 03:42 am
Dude, a first class mail with a vacuum seal is perfect wtf are you talking about?

I agree about the FCM part, not the vacuum seal "Food Saver" bag standard everyone seems to use here.

Now, it's probably "good enough" for most people. But I like to minimize risk to both parties.
Title: Re: We should take *Stealth Shipping* into discourse, or Redefining Stealth Shipping
Post by: vladmir on September 18, 2012, 04:02 am
no one cares that you're upset son, go research and leave your mothers ziplocks at home
Title: Re: We should take *Stealth Shipping* into discourse, or Redefining Stealth Shipping
Post by: LetGoOfYourEgo on September 18, 2012, 04:05 am
I didn't say that vacuum sealing packaging was problematic in all cases, I'm saying the way most sellers here are accomplishing it is.
Title: Re: We should take *Stealth Shipping* into discourse, or Redefining Stealth Shipping
Post by: vladmir on September 18, 2012, 06:17 am
what you are missing is permeation....if this was so easy cartels would just vacuum seal a big 10 ton shipment of cocaine and be confident that no dog will find it.... when you vacuum seal your product what do you think you are accomplishing? creating a minor pressure difference thats it... it does nothing to stop permeation which is inevitable regardless of materials used. what matters is how well your packaging can delay the process to the point at which your package can make it through the mail without being detected just incase... what you need to do is package immediately before sending it out with the proper materials and make absolutely sure the exterior of the package is free of any traces of illicit substances..
Title: Re: We should take *Stealth Shipping* into discourse, or Redefining Stealth Shipping
Post by: duffzilla on September 18, 2012, 07:22 am
I've received items from 'just dropped in the envelope' to 'why the fuck did they send me this? where are my drugs..... OHHHH!'

I tend to leave a note in feedback if the packaging isn't too great. Even a little bit of tape can go a long way to items falling out if the packaging was damaged or opened.

As of late i've had a few items go missing so i am more inclined to buy from vendors stating they use stealth, even had vendors go so far as to message me after a sale is placed to tell me of their devious disguising of the items.

Just my 2 cents but a very important part of the process.

Title: Re: We should take *Stealth Shipping* into discourse, or Redefining Stealth Shipping
Post by: PlutoPete on September 18, 2012, 08:26 am
Are you a succesful seller?
What are your credentials?
Since your so goddamned smart what in the fuck is better than a vacuum seal?
Heat Seal Foil is much better than vac sealing, easier too :)
http://silkroadvb5piz3r.onion/index.php/silkroad/item/3e10560aef
Title: Re: We should take *Stealth Shipping* into discourse, or Redefining Stealth Shipping
Post by: kitkat82 on September 18, 2012, 11:08 pm
I agree.  I am worried that my package is stuck in the mail or lost because of poor packaging.  Haphazard packing and labeling probably raises eyebrows with the postal workers in my small town. 
Title: Re: We should take *Stealth Shipping* into discourse, or Redefining Stealth Shipping
Post by: davebowman on September 19, 2012, 07:02 pm
Good call. I think what we need is to develop the language of the silkroad. What do we, the buyers and reviewers, mean when we say good packaging? As it stands, many claims made regarding packaging have been inconsistent and the terms have lost their meaning.

I just want to say that Cloud Surfer has the best packaging I have seen yet. Better than charasbros even, and his is quite good.
Title: Re: We should take *Stealth Shipping* into discourse, or Redefining Stealth Shipping
Post by: Lightbulb-breaking on September 20, 2012, 03:13 am
Well if it isnt Dave Bowman! Good to hear. Charasbros packaging was a step above! But what I'm trying to stress about the packaging issue is not specifically that vendors use sub-par techniques, though it is an issue, but rather that people in the joy of getting their packages claim *stealth shipping* only for the next guy to find out the shipping is not stealthy whatsoever.

We the buyers through honest reviews have the ability to demand a higher quality of packaging in general.
Title: Re: We should take *Stealth Shipping* into discourse, or Redefining Stealth Shipping
Post by: dave90 on September 20, 2012, 05:19 am
what you are missing is permeation....if this was so easy cartels would just vacuum seal a big 10 ton shipment of cocaine and be confident that no dog will find it.... when you vacuum seal your product what do you think you are accomplishing? creating a minor pressure difference thats it... it does nothing to stop permeation which is inevitable regardless of materials used. what matters is how well your packaging can delay the process to the point at which your package can make it through the mail without being detected just incase... what you need to do is package immediately before sending it out with the proper materials and make absolutely sure the exterior of the package is free of any traces of illicit substances..

Absolutely.  Due to Brownian motion and other processes you are going to get movement through just about any material (Vacuumed sealed or not). The main key is the molecular size of the odor versus the permeability of the wrapping. Both of which can change over time.
Title: Re: We should take *Stealth Shipping* into discourse, or Redefining Stealth Shipping
Post by: thernabulax on September 20, 2012, 08:30 pm
I just have one request for bud vendors:

Please give us the option for sending in a box rather than an envelope, I see most vendors seem to reserve this for large shipments only. It feels sketchy to be able to feel the buds and their size on the outside of the package. Many of us would be glad to pay a bit extra for the flat rate box. And the small box costs basically the same as the envelope.
Title: Re: We should take *Stealth Shipping* into discourse, or Redefining Stealth Shipping
Post by: Shroomeister on September 20, 2012, 08:40 pm
The only problem with the poll is that I have done "all the above" at one point or another.

I HAVE noticed that buyers seem to confuse the term "stealth".

Stealth means "hidden" to me anyway. If I open a package do I see vac packed weed or pills ...or do I see something that still appears legit?


This  should be the definition. When I first started vending on SR and people started to compliment me on the job I was doing I was surprised. I had thought I was just doing and avg job. Apparently not. Alot of people aren't doing enough.

Title: Re: We should take *Stealth Shipping* into discourse, or Redefining Stealth Shipping
Post by: Lightbulb-breaking on September 20, 2012, 10:30 pm
The only problem with the poll is that I have done "all the above" at one point or another.

I HAVE noticed that buyers seem to confuse the term "stealth".

Stealth means "hidden" to me anyway. If I open a package do I see vac packed weed or pills ...or do I see something that still appears legit?


This  should be the definition. When I first started vending on SR and people started to compliment me on the job I was doing I was surprised. I had thought I was just doing and avg job. Apparently not. Alot of people aren't doing enough.

This is what I'm talking about. Stealth should mean the product is legitimately hidden in the event that the parcel is opened. A envelope with a folded piece of paper with a gram of heroin in the middle is not stealth. The issue would appear that many sellers put a greater value on external appearances, expecting that if it looks low key-like a business letter-it will never be checked. But there are random checks, besides a business letter with printed labels from India/ Netherlands/Burma/Whatever to USA or Canada is not incredibly low key. Some sellers do an amazing job and its a great feeling to open a package and think "god damn i never had anything to worry about, this is genius", but for the most part effort just isn't made to hide illicit narcotics in the mail.
Title: Re: We should take *Stealth Shipping* into discourse, or Redefining Stealth Shipping
Post by: gonzorx on September 21, 2012, 02:57 am
I rarely receive stealth as defined this way. a few times from dozens.

However.... when a friend sends me something stealth is IS stealth...and far FAR more intelligent than the bullshit SR vendors produce.

Sure, they have more volume to process and stastics working in their favor. I still think they would be covering their own asses by improving their operational security though.
Title: Re: We should take *Stealth Shipping* into discourse, or Redefining Stealth Shipping
Post by: Lightbulb-breaking on September 21, 2012, 01:32 pm
Even if its rare this is how it should be. All we can do is follow those sellers who uphold the standard hoping that simple economics will force the weaker packagers to follow suit of flounder.
Title: Re: We should take *Stealth Shipping* into discourse, or Redefining Stealth Shipping
Post by: Shroomeister on September 21, 2012, 04:51 pm
I have been contacted by a vendor and asked to help talk about "stealth" to them.

Based on the outcome of this upcoming chat I will update this thread or start a new one with some general procedures that could help everyone....with out being to specific of course.
Title: Re: We should take *Stealth Shipping* into discourse, or Redefining Stealth Shipping
Post by: Lightbulb-breaking on September 21, 2012, 05:18 pm
I have been contacted by a vendor and asked to help talk about "stealth" to them.

Based on the outcome of this upcoming chat I will update this thread or start a new one with some general procedures that could help everyone....with out being to specific of course.

Would be great if you could add it in to this thread. I can already see some progress being made. For one, we agreed that stealth should be understood as hidden in the event of the package being opened
Title: Re: We should take *Stealth Shipping* into discourse, or Redefining Stealth Shipping
Post by: Neville Fucking Bartoz on September 21, 2012, 05:22 pm
My first Silkroad experiences were with a vendor who's packaging was very much "stealth", i.e. there was nothing to suggest anything contraband even when I'd opened the package. However I've since received things just wrapped in a piece of paper and stuffed in the mail, which, in my humble opinion, isn't really good enough. Sure the stuff arrived but I want to know that IF the package is opened it can be overlooked and sent on it's merry way. I don't think this asking to much as it's what I expect having received truly excellent stealth packaging before.
Title: Re: We should take *Stealth Shipping* into discourse, or Redefining Stealth Shipping
Post by: PlutoPete on September 21, 2012, 05:31 pm
I had an order go to resolution recently and ended up giving a refund, the next day the buyer found his order that had arrived a week earlier, been opened and discarded :)
Title: Re: We should take *Stealth Shipping* into discourse, or Redefining Stealth Shipping
Post by: Shroomeister on September 21, 2012, 05:35 pm
I have been contacted by a vendor and asked to help talk about "stealth" to them.

Based on the outcome of this upcoming chat I will update this thread or start a new one with some general procedures that could help everyone....with out being to specific of course.

Would be great if you could add it in to this thread. I can already see some progress being made. For one, we agreed that stealth should be understood as hidden in the event of the package being opened

 Yes I will add the generalizations that comes out of that convo. Not regarding the vendor that I am going to speak with, just regardin generalized techniques.
 
 It is VERY hard to discuss this stuff openly. Needless to say, Someone "brags" about their stealth then they may become a target.
 
 Suffice  it to say that my feedback (for my stealthing) speaks for it self.
 
 ....unless otherwise mentioned in the listing ;)
 
 
 I'll tell ya this though, unless carefully thought out - stealthing "the right way" can become expensive to the vendor. I personally am not complaining, but it is enough of a cost to make some vendors either stop doing it or never do it in the first place.
 
 
 All depends what you vend and how much I suppose.
 
Title: Re: We should take *Stealth Shipping* into discourse, or Redefining Stealth Shipping
Post by: Shroomeister on September 21, 2012, 05:36 pm
I had an order go to resolution recently and ended up giving a refund, the next day the buyer found his order that had arrived a week earlier, been opened and discarded :)

Thats WTF I'm talking about. I had some guys mom open a package from me. He knew what it should have been and was scared as hell.

She opened it, handed it to him and patted him on the back for "doing the right thing"
Title: Re: We should take *Stealth Shipping* into discourse, or Redefining Stealth Shipping
Post by: Lightbulb-breaking on September 21, 2012, 06:33 pm
"Unless carefully thought out" being key. Its the vendors that dont think it out that create the dangers for buyers, especially if they pass along the savings in the packaging department into the selling price. Creates a tempting trap. Certainly makes you think more about that vendor with the comparable product slightly higher than his closest competitor a bit more seriously. The silk road being a free market we have to vote with our bitocins for better packaging.

Interestingly, the things I have purchased which carry the heaviest penalties have had the poorest packaging, but that is just me.
Auf Wiedersehen