Silk Road forums
Discussion => Drug safety => Topic started by: sprenglberg on June 22, 2012, 04:42 pm
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Sup sprenglberg here
okay so I just wanted to talk about a cannabis experience I had lately. my drug experiences really are quite poor; I have consumed tons of alcohol in the past, few times smoked weed (mostly in combination with alcohol) and Kratom. since I can't really remember the few weed-experiences I had because of the alcohol, and the other times it seemed to be rather cheap commercial weed that didn't really please me, I thought I'll just try again and order a bit, to see what weed is like when you get good quality.
so I ordered some (supposedly top quality) Chronic on SR which arrived few days ago. I know it's actually a indica dominant hybrid but it said this one was very indica-y. however, I smoked it pure in a (very cheap) tabacco pipe with a filter. was pretty excited and curious and took a few deep or less deep hits from the pipe and tried to keep as long as possible in the lungs (which burnt pretty fucking much in the throat). then pretty soon some effects showed up, like a rather unpleasant hammering in the head, something that I guess you'd call a 'cottonmouth', heavy eyelids, and a overall weird body-feeling which I found very discomforting. other than that I didn't really feel anything. also felt a bit of paranoid, because right after I smoked I was called to dinner with my parents and I had this stupid grin I couldn't get off.
of course, I know, set & setting, but I don't think it was too wrong. except for the fact I wasn't alone, I was in a normal mood (which is a rather depressed one in my case), but that's actually also one of the reason why I decided to give it a try again. I thought I could relax, switch off and think a bit clearer, but after all it made me feel very uneasy. I dunno, maybe I'm underestimating weed. but I rather think that it just doesn't work for me or I'm simply expecting too much, since the last time I've smoked weed it had the same unpleasant effects on me. I also suspected that I just smoked too much, but it really only was a very little amount.
have to say I'm quite disappointed, because I thought I'll have a fun time this time, since this is top weed. it actually were all indica-effects that I found displeasing because it didn't do anything for me except making me paranoid, lazy and giving me this disgusting body feeling, so I thought it would make sense to try some pure sativa or a sativa dominant strain next time, also it's effects just sound much more appealing. I've also read that people exaggerate the difference between indica & sativa, but I dunno since I never tried sativa. I'm also interested in psychedelics, but I don't know if it's a good idea if you're dealing with severe depression. All I'm looking for is a change of perspective...
Would be nice if you could share your experiences and/or give me some advice. Thanks.
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I'd suggest trying a sativa-dominant strain. I do my best to refrain from the indica species just because I get the same gross couch-lock lazy feeling. Most recently, Blue Dream seems to be my favorite. Do a quick google search of most popular/favorite sativas.
Best of luck,
sdesu
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It sounds like you're underage? Or at least still live with your parents? Either way, I found I wasn't really able to enjoy weed till I had moved out on my own, and didn't have to to worry about getting caught. The paranoia would always take over, and while not frightening it was hard to focus on anything else, and basically made it pretty unenjoyable. So I had basically given up on it because I thought that's just the way weed is. I'd even turn it down when friends were smoking (long, long, after I'd moved out on my own) until one day I did because I didn't have any other of my drugs of choice, and I didn't experience any of the negative feelings I had when I was younger.
It's still not my drug of choice, but I do at least enjoy it when I do it now.
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sprenglberg, two things:
1. If you're depressed, abstain from alcohol completely. In my experience it makes depression worse, and
2. Enjoying cannabis can be a journey. Personally, SR helps me to know what am I smoking and that breeds pleasure and confidence. Try some different strains in small amounts - don't give up on it yet. Best of luck to you.
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First off (and I say this to almost anyone who says they don't enjoy weed) smoke a smaller amount. The chronic that we have today is extremely potent and for some, one large hit can be like an overdose and lead to discomfort. Take a small puff, put the pipe down, wait a few minutes and see what happens.
You can always toke more but you can never toke less.
Second, even though many say they cannot tell the difference, there are many others that can tell the difference between indica and sativa. For depression issues I would definitely choose sativa. There is a strain called Green Crack that had me cleaning the whole house every time I smoked it.
Third, smoke when you don't have any plans. I have smoked weed on and off for many years, but if I was called for a family dinner, or really anything where people were not supposed to know I was stoned, I would not be amused. Clear your schedule
and put in a movie or play some music. Don't leave the house unless YOU want to.
Also, I highly recommend psychedelics, but I suggest getting a bit more experienced with weed and also getting your depression under control. Psychedelics tend to amplify the current mood that you are in. Hope this helps. Good luck!
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As an experienced cannabis grower I can tell you the difference between a true indica and sativa is night and day. Headaches I've found occur when a lot of THC is convert to CBN's through degradation. I have no scientific evidence verifying this but from my own strains and years of experience, and always scoping my bud to look at the amber content which is itself a manifestation of THC degraded into CBN's, that it is usually the case. I'm not saying if you have a bunch of amber trichs you'll get a headache, this is all strain dependent (varying ratio of cannabinoids and all).
The suggestions for sativa are good ones indeed, a good sativa is uplifiting and energizing. However, it induces more paranoia to those that are susceptible. The point of this herb for me is relaxation and meditation. Not to mention it helps with my insulin levels (diabetic) hence the wonderful medical cannabis community I'm a part of.
My only concern with product from other growers is I don't know how it was grown, I don't know how it was processed, there are a lot of unknowns. Here it costs $40 to get .5g of cannabis tested for cannabinoid levels and presence of mold. Valuable to me and others with concern, have a trusted source, be in a trusting environment, and if intrigued allow a new chemical to guide you in a safe manner.
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Agreed. The active ingredient in marijuana (THC) is a neuro-sedative, so it comes as no surprise that smoking a stronger strain of weed with a higher THC level is going to get all over on you in a hurry. My suggestion would be to roll pin joints with any remaining weed or take smaller numbers of hits from a bowl an follow previous poster's advice about smoking it when you have nowhere to be or nothing to do. I know that when I smoke weed, I don't want to interact with anyone that doesn't already know I smoke weed if I don't have to.
Some of the physical effects can be masked to prevent the casual observer from noticing that you're high. Use red removing eye drops and a good mouth wash afterwards and wash your hands well to remove the funk. Mustard also works well ad removing weed scent/flavors from your mouth, so keep a couple of packets of mustard handy for when you're ready to burn (I keep mine in my car's glove box). Changing your clothes will remove a lot of the residual smoke from your body.
The couch lock feeling (stupor) is a dosage issue and can be reduced. I like to smoke just enough to start feeling a buzz and then stop right there, keeping an even stone for an hour or two. The headache is usually caused by excessive coughing while smoking weed. This usually goes away once you're a more experienced smoker. Hack and cough so hard you feel like your gonna barf up a lung will give you a headache fast. Solution: Take an advil.
Eating something will also help bring you down from your high pretty fast. A lot of weeds will bring on the munchies very quickly so resist the urge to eat if you want the buzz to last longer, or if you're too high, eat something with plenty of carbs to bring yourself down a little.
Now, technically there is no difference between Cannabis sativa and Cannabis sativa sub. indica. They're both really Cannabis sativa and will readily and easily cross-breed. That being said, just like there are several breeds of dogs, there are several "strains" of cannabis that have been bred to exhibit specific traits. "Indica" cannabis strains originated in Asia and the Middle East and were cultivated for the hashish trade. Hashish is essentially just compressed trichromes (pollum) from marijuana plants. Why is this important, because THC forms/occurs only in the trichromes of the marijuana plant. Those sugary looking crystals on high quality marijuana flowers? Those are the trichromes. So, indica plants were bred to produce a lot of trichromes and by default, are higher in THC concentration than a lot of sativa strains. Sativa strains will get you high, make no mistake. It's just that overall, they aren't as strong as indica strains. Many people smoke sativa strains because they don't want to get quite as high as with indica strains for various reasons.
Hope this helps clarify.
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Welcome to the Road and the forums.
I'm a medicinal cannabis patient myself, who lives in the UK and without growing your own, which really you need the right premises for that I don't have access to, Silk Road cannabis offerings from the States and Canada seem to be the best.
Did you buy the recent "Chronic" listing that was either advertised as "Chronic I" or "Chronic II"?
The thing I think a lot of people often forget is drug use and experiences are mostly subjective. Obviously, there's a certain level of expectation considering the varieties of strains (low/mid/ high grade) these days, but I found out a while ago that one Indica (body-high) can give a totally different experience to another Indica, and despite Cannabis Indica often being the type to relax and relieve, there are some types of Indica strains that give Sativa effects.
Great example - G13. Often, the effects are regarded as happy and uplifting, euphoric - often the characteristics of a Sativa, yet this is actually an Indica dominant strain. It really does differ that much.
I prefer my Indica body stone because with these I can really tell that the product is effecting (and helping) me. Sativa's aren't that common in the UK due to dealers preferring the denser bud offerings that's provided by Indica more than Sativa strains. It would, however, appear that a Sativa (head-high) would benefit you more.
I've been searching for two years for my ideal strains. I'm about to place an order for an Ounce, half of which should keep me active during the day, the other should prevent my body from moving and put me to sleep.
Every cannabis strain will also have different ratings of > THC (Delta-9 Tetrahydrocannabinol) the most phsychoactive component, then you have CBD and also CBN. These ratings will depend on a number of factors (grow quality, strain, conditions, etc) and in result will effect the overall experience. For example, some well grown weed may get you very high, but if it's not cured correctly, it could tickle to smoke and cause one to cough.
I have a colleague who's tried cannabis recently to help aid with their osteoporosis, and ate 0.8g of Cannabis in a chocolate cake edible. Whilst this was too much for them, and the effects weren't desired (panic attack a little too much!), the pain was numbed and relaxation set in after 2 hours.
It really depends on a number of things. Please consider the advise of trying different varieties, from different sellers, and see if you continuously get the same results. If you did, obviously Cannabis mustn't go down well with you!
Hope this helps.
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Thanks for all the replies first off.
Did you buy the recent "Chronic" listing that was either advertised as "Chronic I" or "Chronic II"?
No, it was just listed as "Chronic"
But, yeah, I'll try it again with a little less and when I'm sure I won't be disturbed by anyone.
however, I'll probably just order a little amount of a sativa and give it a try. The only problem is you hardly find sativa weed when you're in the EU, and most of the murricans don't ship here :/ One seller though who seems to have good stuff in smaller amounts and ships here is "PuffDaddy", thought of trying his Haze...
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For some reason it pisses me off when people discuss weed as though it was a hard drug. But hey, that's just me. ::)
Quick question though if you don't mind answering sprenglberg...how young are you? Between 10-12? Or 13-15? ???
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Well, can't help that. Also, where is it "discussed as a hard drug"? It's a drug, and it can be discussed like any other one, even if it's not a harrrrrd drug. ::)
Almost had it, I'm 16. But how is that so relevant?
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maybe you should avoid recreational drugs and opt for a therapist. weeds not gonna cure your depression and i dont think hallucinogens are a solution for you either
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Of course depression isn't cured by any drugs and I'm aware of that... I'm not looking for any antidepressant substitute, just thought the depression-issue should be mentioned.
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Well, can't help that. Also, where is it "discussed as a hard drug"? It's a drug, and it can be discussed like any other one, even if it's not a harrrrrd drug. ::)
Almost had it, I'm 16. But how is that so relevant?
I want you to understand that I am an asshole, so don't take anything I say personally because I'm like this to everyone.
So anyways, the fact that you call smoking weed an 'experience' is what I was referring to. ::) In my group of friends, we'd all laugh at you for that. No offense but weed, booze, and kratom are all kiddy stuff, granted you are a kid though. You're inexperienced and don't know any better so I can't blame you. ;) At least you came asking for advice, so that's one thing you've done right. ^-^
Something that stood out in your story is that you apparently hold your tokes in for as long as possible. That's bad....M'kay? Holding a hit in any longer than 10 seconds is pointless and is only depriving your brain of oxygen which is very likely the cause behind your bad experience. I'd take smaller hits as well like previously advised if your tolerance isn't that great. If you think burning your throat impacted your high at all then buy a bong. I own a small RooR I purchased for only $60 which would be perfect for you, as it has notches for holding ice and is small enough to conceal easily. I see similar ones in just about every smoke shop I visit so getting a hold of one shouldn't be too hard. Remember to drink plenty of water while smoking if the cotton mouth bugs you too.
If you're dealing with severe depression, I highly recommend you give psychedelics a chance! I started much younger than you and they saved my life countless times when my depression got too bad to handle. Even dissociatives, specifically Ketamine and Methoxetamine (MXE), can help depression better than anti-depressants for most people and have less side-effects than most prescription pills. At least give mushrooms or LSD a shot though considering they're relatively safe and understood, and the afterglow can last for weeks. If you want to give some RC's a try, then 4-AcO-DMT; 2C-B; and 25i-NBOMe would be nice. If you're not too afraid to try MDMA then buy a small 100mg sample and take it at a concert or an amusement park because it will be one of the happiest nights of your life. I'm exhausted right now due to sleep deprivation so I apologize for my crappy typing but if you have any questions I'll be more than happy to help! :D
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maybe you should avoid recreational drugs and opt for a therapist. weeds not gonna cure your depression and i dont think hallucinogens are a solution for you either
You don't know what you're talking about. Obviously they won't cure his depression, but they'll allow him to see life in a different light and give him the chance to learn more about himself and his place in our universe. Drugs can give him the confidence he needs to take on life, or even bring him closer to his faith and inspire creativity which will stick to him for years to come.
Oh, and sprengleberg! A tip to make smoking less harsh on your lungs is as soon as you're done taking a hit breathe in as much more air as you can through your nostrils while holding it in. Also once you exhale all the smoke out, take a big gulp of air and breathe deeply to soothe your lungs. Always exhale longer than you inhale too, it'll feel so much better, trust me! ;)
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Of course depression isn't cured by any drugs and I'm aware of that... I'm not looking for any antidepressant substitute, just thought the depression-issue should be mentioned.
Depression is a serious matter that should be mentioned and considered.
If you suspect you are suffering from depression, it would be best ti discuss this with your GP before considering drugs to do something about it. Smoking some pot is not likely to alleviate depression on the long run, and can be pretty catastrophic short term as well.
I strongly believe in that you should be able to use whatever substance fits your needs, but in these circumstances i would seriously recommend consulting a medical professional before self medication.
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Of course depression isn't cured by any drugs and I'm aware of that... I'm not looking for any antidepressant substitute, just thought the depression-issue should be mentioned.
Depression is a serious matter that should be mentioned and considered.
If you suspect you are suffering from depression, it would be best ti discuss this with your GP before considering drugs to do something about it. Smoking some pot is not likely to alleviate depression on the long run, and can be pretty catastrophic short term as well.
I strongly believe in that you should be able to use whatever substance fits your needs, but in these circumstances i would seriously recommend consulting a medical professional before self medication.
He's only 16 though, and most doctors shy away from prescribing anti-depressants due to the increase in suicidal thoughts in children under the age of 18. So perhaps some counseling/therapy would be better suited for his conditions.
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http://www.kurzweilai.net/ketamine-improved-bipolar-depression-within-minutes Or, to quote the article for those who don't want to open it:
A single dose of ketamine significantly improved depression symptoms for 79 percent of patients within 40 minutes, and remained improved over three days, researchers at the National Institute of Mental Health found. Now they’ve replicated that finding for patients with bipolar disorder.
Bipolar disorder is a serious and debilitating condition where individuals experience severe swings in mood between mania and depression. The episodes of low or elevated mood can last days or months, and the risk of suicide is high.
Importantly, and for the first time in a group of patients with bipolar depression, they also found that ketamine significantly reduced suicidal thoughts. These antisuicidal effects also occurred within one hour. Considering that bipolar disorder is one of the most lethal of all psychiatric disorders, these study findings could have a major impact on public health.
“Our finding that a single infusion of ketamine produces rapid antidepressant and antisuicidal effects within one hour and that is fairly sustained is truly exciting,” Dr. Zarate commented. “We think that these findings are of true importance given that we only have a few treatments approved for acute bipolar depression, and none of them have this rapid onset of action; they usually take weeks or longer to have comparable antidepressant effects as ketamine does.”
Ketamine is an N-methyl-D-aspartate (NMDA) receptor antagonist, which means that it works by blocking the actions of NMDA. Dr. Zarate added, “Importantly, confirmation that blocking the NMDA receptor complex is involved in generating rapid antidepressant and antisuicidal effects offers an avenue for developing the next generation of treatments for depression that are radically different than existing ones.”
Ref.: Carlos A. Zarate Jr. et al., Replication of Ketamine’s Antidepressant Efficacy in Bipolar Depression: A Randomized Controlled Add-On Trial, Biological Psychiatry, 2012, DIU: 10.1016/j.biopsych.2011.12.010 (http://dx.doi.org/10.1016/j.biopsych.2011.12.010)
Just thought I'd add in some scientific evidence to GaryOak's claims of ketamine helping.
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Is anyone happy at 16? I, for one, hated life in my teen years. I sincerely believe the only thing that got me through high school was being stoned the entire time. Pulled decent grades too. Parents put me on anti-depressants that made me think about killing myself even more and when I stopped taking them it felt like electric shocks in my brain. I despised every therapist they sent me to.
And I really can't think of a better anti-depressant than being the kid in school with access to SR drugs 8)
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Of course depression isn't cured by any drugs and I'm aware of that... I'm not looking for any antidepressant substitute, just thought the depression-issue should be mentioned.
Depression is a serious matter that should be mentioned and considered.
If you suspect you are suffering from depression, it would be best ti discuss this with your GP before considering drugs to do something about it. Smoking some pot is not likely to alleviate depression on the long run, and can be pretty catastrophic short term as well.
I strongly believe in that you should be able to use whatever substance fits your needs, but in these circumstances i would seriously recommend consulting a medical professional before self medication.
He's only 16 though, and most doctors shy away from prescribing anti-depressants due to the increase in suicidal thoughts in children under the age of 18. So perhaps some counseling/therapy would be better suited for his conditions.
I only suggested to consult with a gp to do -somehting- about it. Depending on the country you live in, at the age of 16 that may be therapy, medication, both, or none at all and 'deal with it'.
What option is preferable i could not say from a distance. Living in holland i can say that many people experiment with cannabis from fairly young age (14/15/16 or so) and most do not suffer any lasting negative effects. I guess most of us actually smoked a couple of joints around the age of 16, which in itself no problem at all.
If you use cannabis as a cure to anything you remotely consider an ailment i would still advise seeking medical advise though. At 16 you may very well be depressed because life actually sucks, but getting confirmed that really is the reason does no harm.
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I have been at a therapist not too long ago and got antidepressants subscribed. The doctor told me I shouldn't experiment with drugs in the future because of the effects the antidepressants would have on them etc etc. I don't know to what extent that's true, because he also meant I'd be too young to consume drugs and that they would have a very bad impact on my brain, since it's still evolving etc. However I've also ordered shrooms on the road, which is now one month ago but unfortunately my father found out and of course took them away... meh... Wouldn't thought that would happen since he didn't notice anything in the past but whatever. It sucks because it cost me 10BTC...
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I have been at a therapist not too long ago and got antidepressants subscribed. The doctor told me I shouldn't experiment with drugs in the future because of the effects the antidepressants would have on them etc etc. I don't know to what extent that's true, because he also meant I'd be too young to consume drugs and that they would have a very bad impact on my brain, since it's still evolving etc. However I've also ordered shrooms on the road, which is now one month ago but unfortunately my father found out and of course took them away... meh... Wouldn't thought that would happen since he didn't notice anything in the past but whatever. It sucks because it cost me 10BTC...
Cannabis+Prozac=Bad Trip. I have a friend that went through that.
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Some medical practitioners will frown upon using drugs apart from those they prescribe themselves.
There is, however, merit in advising against experimenting with drugs while taking antidepressants. I suppose the antidepressants are SSRIs, which will strongly alter the effects of taking drugs like mdma.
As for being young and therefor more sensitive to damage from drugs they are right however. If you are 16 years old, it would be advisable to take developing brain into consideration. This does not mean you must never smoke a joint, drink alcohol or take xtc (though that will not combine well with your meds) - within moderation drinking some alcohol or smoking some pot at 16 will not turn you into a vegetable at all, but using drugs like that on a daily basis will have effects on your mental development.
If you keep it to smoking a joint and/or drinking a sixpack on a weekend night you will not instantly turn into a mindless turd, but don't make it a daily habit either. I know the legal drinking age is 21 in the US, but in europe most youngsters have experiences with alcohol and pot starting at a much lower age (14 yr or so, legally 16 and over). Most of them do not end up as junkies though, and i consider it part of growing up.
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Yes I'm taking a SSRI and also AAP(antiypsychotics). I'm not planning on smoking pot that much, I'm actually more interested in psychedelics/dissociatives... actually to name it, I would like to try Ketamine, but I don't know if it's harmful in combination with the meds...
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I think you should be careful there. Ketamine is a pretty serious drug to begin with, and combined with your age and prescription meds its probably not a good idea to try.
Surely I don't want to be an old fart telling you what to do (or mostly don't), but if you do decide to go ahead with it, at least make sure not to do it alone.. If anything goes seriously wrong, it would be preferable to have someone reasonably sober nearby to call an ambulance. I don't think its likely experimenting with it would lead to a situation that requires treatment in hospital, but having that option available would be a good thing.