Silk Road forums

Discussion => Security => Topic started by: Kappacino on April 22, 2012, 03:23 am

Title: Tor - Can computers on the network see traffic data?
Post by: Kappacino on April 22, 2012, 03:23 am
I doubt it a lot but can the computers that we connect through using Tor see the inbound/outbound traffic that goes through them?

If not, what standard of encryption is used?
Title: Re: Tor - Can computers on the network see traffic data?
Post by: Jaurk on April 22, 2012, 03:27 am
Can computers on the network see traffic data?
Well, with a WLAN network, you can see the data using wireshark, but TOR would be obfuscated I'm guessing.
I haven't really researched it.
Title: Re: Tor - Can computers on the network see traffic data?
Post by: supersecretsquirrel on April 22, 2012, 08:37 am
I doubt it a lot but can the computers that we connect through using Tor see the inbound/outbound traffic that goes through them?

When browsing the public Internet over Tor, the exit relay operator can see which websites you are visiting -- but not who you are. This is exactly why use of SSL is so extremely important. Exit relay operators snooping on your traffic is not an issue when you are browsing hidden services, simply because you have more hops and you never exit onto the public Internet.
Title: Re: Tor - Can computers on the network see traffic data?
Post by: Kappacino on April 22, 2012, 08:47 am
I doubt it a lot but can the computers that we connect through using Tor see the inbound/outbound traffic that goes through them?

When browsing the public Internet over Tor, the exit relay operator can see which websites you are visiting -- but not who you are. This is exactly why use of SSL is so extremely important. Exit relay operators snooping on your traffic is not an issue when you are browsing hidden services, simply because you have more hops and you never exit onto the public Internet.

So you mean they can see the site for example www.silkroadvb5piz3r.onion, but can they actually physically SEE the pages as I would view them?
Title: Re: Tor - Can computers on the network see traffic data?
Post by: tweedledumb on April 22, 2012, 09:20 am
because SR is a hidden service, your network traffic w/it never exits TOR network. It never hits an exit node. The exit node is the only node that processes non-obfuscated data.

Sorry, I digress (tweaking a little bit). The answer to your most recent post is "No. No one can see that you are browsing any site that ends in .onion."

If you were using TOR to browse xhamster.com, then the machine that is operating as the exit node for that session would be able to determine that someone, somewhere, is browsing xhamster.com.
Title: Re: Tor - Can computers on the network see traffic data?
Post by: supersecretsquirrel on April 22, 2012, 10:39 am
I doubt it a lot but can the computers that we connect through using Tor see the inbound/outbound traffic that goes through them?

When browsing the public Internet over Tor, the exit relay operator can see which websites you are visiting -- but not who you are. This is exactly why use of SSL is so extremely important. Exit relay operators snooping on your traffic is not an issue when you are browsing hidden services, simply because you have more hops and you never exit onto the public Internet.

So you mean they can see the site for example www.silkroadvb5piz3r.onion, but can they actually physically SEE the pages as I would view them?

No relay operator can see that you are browsing Silk Road. An exit relay operator could, however, see that someone is browsing www.reddit.com.
Title: Re: Tor - Can computers on the network see traffic data?
Post by: thereisnospoon on April 27, 2012, 12:20 am
Tor:

sorry if this is not close enough to OP.

I'm wondering, has Tor ever actually been "Cracked"? As in, has anyone, person, group gotten snagged, popped or whatever through solely the Tor network... has anyone been actually routed from being on Tor and being found to have participated in something less than legal, through tor, and been caught?

Or is this yet to have happened? Or is this unknown?

I know most here use multiple separations and programs and aids for evasion but what if someone used their home, PC, basically everything personal but only used them through tor? And I'm not saying using easy usernames or identifying characters...

Any knowledge or Tor breakdown?
Title: Re: Tor - Can computers on the network see traffic data?
Post by: QTC on April 27, 2012, 12:27 am
The Tor network is susceptible to many different attacks, this is especially true for location hidden services like SR. arma, the lead developer of Tor, will tell anybody willing to listen that hidden services are totally fucked. But at the same time I know of nobody who's been pwnt because Tor was pwnt, in every CP or carder bust I've read discovery info for for example, people who used VPNs were caught but people who used Tor got away.
Title: Re: Tor - Can computers on the network see traffic data?
Post by: Joosy on April 27, 2012, 12:40 am
Tor:

sorry if this is not close enough to OP.

I'm wondering, has Tor ever actually been "Cracked"? As in, has anyone, person, group gotten snagged, popped or whatever through solely the Tor network... has anyone been actually routed from being on Tor and being found to have participated in something less than legal, through tor, and been caught?

Or is this yet to have happened? Or is this unknown?

I know most here use multiple separations and programs and aids for evasion but what if someone used their home, PC, basically everything personal but only used them through tor? And I'm not saying using easy usernames or identifying characters...

Any knowledge or Tor breakdown?

There have been some claims from individuals claiming to comprise the anonymity of the TOR network, which have been debatable. However, could the NSA completely fuck TOR and SSL encryption if they directed major resources to it? Of course. 
Title: Re: Tor - Can computers on the network see traffic data?
Post by: Diamond on April 27, 2012, 02:56 am
Can computers on the network see traffic data?
Well, with a WLAN network, you can see the data using wireshark, but TOR would be obfuscated I'm guessing.
I haven't really researched it.

I've asked this question here and elsewhere, and the answer I received was that someone (something) watching network traffic would see encrypted packets being sent out to the first node, but nothing after that.

Also, (to the OP), if your connection to a clearnet site is encrypted, then someone watching an exit relay would only see the connection to the site, not the content of the data being sent back and forth. I also don't think they could see what IP address the traffic originated at either, unless it's being directly broadcast (like with BitTorrent or Bitcoin software).


Quote
arma, the lead developer of Tor, will tell anybody willing to listen that hidden services are totally fucked.

Any links to that? I'd like to read what he has to say.