Silk Road forums

Discussion => Security => Topic started by: phubaiblues on July 04, 2011, 05:01 am

Title: Sellers Requesting Confirmation of Delivery
Post by: phubaiblues on July 04, 2011, 05:01 am
I'm operating on the theory we all want to protect each other.  Financially, I want sellers to do well, to prosper, to stay in business.  I want them to make whatever concessions they need to, to keep us safe from getting busted.

We have to often use houses where we have no legal abode--or our own.  Lately I've heard sellers saying--and recommending--that they get a confirmed delivery receipt.  Doen't you think this jeopardizes buyers.  It attracts attention to the drop...and makes the mailman have to take note, and if it is a house where no one is there, doesn't it make them more inclined not to drop of letter?

Also, some of us, get our mail under fake names, at our own houses, and confirmed delivery, well, it makes mailmen ask if this person actually lives in the house.

I would like to hear some input from people more in the know, but I find this a frightening devlopment.  The best packaging for me, is just plain old letter with a stamp on it...*anything* that makes a mailman take note of delivery, is bad from where I sit...

Any sellers wish to comment on this?  Some serious risks we are taking here, and I thought only LE would want anything like this...I was surprised to read that some  sellers want it...need an explaination....thankyou!
Title: Re: Sellers Requesting Confirmation of Delivery
Post by: rake on July 04, 2011, 05:40 am
I honestly don't see the point of it.  Who is going to call the postal office and ask where their package of drugs is?  Knowing this, a seller could simply quote a dodgy confirmation number.
Title: Re: Sellers Requesting Confirmation of Delivery
Post by: barbasolshavingcreamcan on July 04, 2011, 06:18 am
I honestly don't see the point of it.  Who is going to call the postal office and ask where their package of drugs is?  Knowing this, a seller could simply quote a dodgy confirmation number.

Delivery confirmation does not equal tracking. It just tells you when the item has been delivered. The point of it is to protect sellers from people saying that the package was never delivered. Also, you can check status of the delivery confirmation online...you do not need to call.
Title: Re: Sellers Requesting Confirmation of Delivery
Post by: XMachina on July 04, 2011, 06:38 am
I don't see the problem with delivery confirmation looking suspicious, assuming you mean the usps service. It doesn't require a signature. They just scan it in to the system.

When a buyer says it didn't show up, delivery confirmation can shed some light real quick. They can register a new buyer account true, but if the vendor puts that zip code on their naughty list, it helps thwarts a repeat scammer.

If its true that checking tracking/deliver confirmation through Tor is a NO-NO, then you should be concerned that you seller is not haphazardly checking packages to your "safe" address using such means. It has been suggested that this flags the address/package. You have no idea who you are dealing with. I'm sure all the vendors are equally adept at matters of security. :)

What  may make your mail man suspicious, is you receiving packages from all over the country all the time like some sort of perpetual birthday celebration. Then again, it may not. Nothing is written. If DC looks suspicious where you are, then make sure you discuss it with your vendor ahead of time. 

Title: Re: Sellers Requesting Confirmation of Delivery
Post by: g4bb3r on July 04, 2011, 07:21 am
Delivery confirmation requires no signature / etc., the postman simply scans the barcode when it's dropped in your mailbox to update the system. There is nothing suspicious about it, and it's used all the time by legitimate online businesses such as eBay stores for the exact same reasons sellers here want to use it -- to prove what they shipped was delivered.
Title: Re: Sellers Requesting Confirmation of Delivery
Post by: redtide on July 04, 2011, 07:25 am
turn away anything that requires a signature, period.
Title: Re: Sellers Requesting Confirmation of Delivery
Post by: rake on July 04, 2011, 11:49 am
Delivery confirmation requires no signature / etc., the postman simply scans the barcode when it's dropped in your mailbox to update the system. There is nothing suspicious about it, and it's used all the time by legitimate online businesses such as eBay stores for the exact same reasons sellers here want to use it -- to prove what they shipped was delivered.

I think you'll find that it means different things in different countries.
Title: Re: Sellers Requesting Confirmation of Delivery
Post by: phubaiblues on July 05, 2011, 05:33 am
Nothing I've read here gives me any reassurance at all: It still attracts attention to the letter.  Please don't do this...we are getting letters which need no attention at all...and to confirm delivery means they take note of the letter...some of you seem to think buyers are attempting to rip u off, but you are jeopardizing your buyers by doing this...we want our letters to be unnoticed, to be one step above *junk* mail, and to ask for confirmation puts us in a different group of mail.  Please don't ask for confirmation.  It's not a commonplace practice anymore, and we don't want *anything* out of the ordinary.  The idea is to get it to blend in with other mail, and many of us have enough worries upon pickup, without thinking now our letter is a different group...I get it that all they do is click there little meter...but when they know the addresseee isn't at that address: my mailmen do, so would you, and then you add a confirmation on to it, it's a whole different package...

I don't think most sellers do that...are those of you that do, getting ripped off by buyers?  I haven't heard any of the buyers I know say this is really a problem. 
Title: Re: Sellers Requesting Confirmation of Delivery
Post by: Colonel Sanders on July 05, 2011, 06:54 am
This is a moot point, because you can't put Delivery Confirmation on a regular first class letter anyway.

I mean you CAN, you can physically put the sticker on there, but the USPS doesn't allow it on first class letters so it might draw attention for that reason but not for the one you're worrying about.  And I'm not sure it would scan correctly and track it anyway.

You can put Delivery Confirmation on the flat rate envelopes, though, but that's Priority Mail. 

And there's absolutely nothing attention-drawing about putting Delivery Confirmation on flat rate boxes and envelopes.  There are ten zillion eBay packages zipping around right now with it on it.  It's part of why you never see shipping lower than $5-6 on eBay anymore.
Title: Re: Sellers Requesting Confirmation of Delivery
Post by: phubaiblues on July 05, 2011, 07:19 pm
Well, not much I can do about it on my end, anyway...if just, to be blunt, some of us get these in houses which aren't really occupied, and well, they always seem to still get junk mail...and hopefully goodies...but I fear anything that smacks of 'important mail' might get noticed and set aside...I had mailman start asking questions at previous address, and I still don't know why it happened, but he came up w/3 envelopes asking if person lived there....it seems at least, once u get a buyer that---like most of us--is legit, there wouldn't be a need for this...also, it wouldn't really slow down a scam artist anyway, for obvious reasons...(empty package, blah blah blah), and, as I've stated elsewhere, I haven't seen sellers posting about ripoff buyers: too much trouble, IMHO...a bad buyer goes to sites w/no escrow...like BM...(used to be)
Title: Re: Sellers Requesting Confirmation of Delivery
Post by: XMachina on July 05, 2011, 07:42 pm
Not everything can be sent in a first-class envelope. It really seems like you need to discuss this with your vendor before ordering. You can post about it all you want, but if your vendor doesn't agree than what does it matter? This is your situation, not everyones IMO. I do agree that putting dellivery confirmation on a little first class envelope makes no sense.
Title: Re: Sellers Requesting Confirmation of Delivery
Post by: username on July 05, 2011, 11:09 pm
I used to sell quite a bit on eBay, and have done a fair amount of buying as well.  Delivery Confirmation was on every single package I ever shipped, and damn near every package I've ever received.  Vendors here would probably do well to look as much like eBay sellers as possible, because that's likely the closest legit traffic that you can blend in with.

I don't claim to be any sort of expert, but that said, I have NEVER seen anyone pay for Delivery Confirmation with a fucking stamp.  That alone has to be a GIANT RED FLAG for the inspectors and/or delivery person.  Always make your shit blend in.  Don't be the low-hanging fruit for LE to pick off.
Title: Re: Sellers Requesting Confirmation of Delivery
Post by: listentothemusic on July 05, 2011, 11:23 pm
You are just being paranoid. Delivery Confirmation is just a point of scan of it being sent and received. Millions of packages are sent a day, more than half have confirmation. Use the return address of "Tom's Mobile Phone Parts" and voila looks like a tracked package.
Title: Re: Sellers Requesting Confirmation of Delivery
Post by: ketuvim on July 06, 2011, 12:25 am
Col. Sanders is incorrect.  Regular first class mail can be given a delcon.  These delivery confirmation numbers are not suspicious at all and serve to protect the seller from unscrupulous buyers.  It also allows the seller to see which customers are not confirming their orders and thus be more selective in who they do business with.  You have nothing to worry about.  It does not make the package suspicious at all.
Title: Re: Sellers Requesting Confirmation of Delivery
Post by: phubaiblues on July 06, 2011, 01:14 am
OK: I appreciate the replies.  I do think that the final point is where buyers need to show the most caution: it's where we are most vulnerable.  I think we need to step lightly on calling those of us with questions 'paranoid' tho.  We're all taking big chances here, and I doubt anybody with serious paranoia would even be here, after all the public hoopla. 

Me and my sellers get along fine, and the reason I asked publicly for some info on it, as I'd had just found out that many sellers do request confirmation,  and I wanted to know what were the good reasons for doing it--and I get that--and whether or not my concerns were legit or not. 

I know when buyers of the product I like get worried, we post threads publicly to see if others are having same problem with specific seller, and seller too, can jump in tell us what's up, and this seems to work out pretty good. 

If you all actually have some buyers that you think are claiming they didn't receive product--in order not to pay--then I think you should post on it too.  We don't want to cause ill will over something that isn't really happening.

Title: Re: Sellers Requesting Confirmation of Delivery
Post by: Colonel Sanders on July 06, 2011, 05:04 am
Col. Sanders is incorrect.  Regular first class mail can be given a delcon.

No, I'm NOT--you are, because that's not what I said.  I never said you can't do Delivery Confirmation with first class.  I said you can't do it with a first class LETTER--and you can't.  You can do it with a first class PARCEL, though.

Check the USPS site if you think I'm wrong.  I'm not.  They don't allow you to put Delivery Confirmation on first class letters.