Silk Road forums

Discussion => Silk Road discussion => Topic started by: fuckingACE on September 10, 2013, 03:02 am

Title: Silk Road Newbies and their constant fear of being scammed... :/
Post by: fuckingACE on September 10, 2013, 03:02 am
So I had another one today, and I´m beginning to see a pattern.

It´s the scenario in which a package is delayed or for whatever reason hasn´t shown up. I remember before in this situation the buyer would put a calm email to the seller stating the problem and the seller would put it right, no accusations, no paranoia...
However all of a sudden, the last month perhaps, I´ve seen an increase of people automatically assuming that every seller here who dosent manage to get a package to its destination on time and first time is a selective scammer!? If a package is late, automatically were scamming them, even with the most ridiculous listings.. Why the fuck would any seller try and scam someone for a 5 dollar product? :/ Here´s the message Read from the bottom up:

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The Scurvy Crew 5.0                Are you sure it was a scam? it would cost more to scam people for 5$ listings than it would to send the product, if you account for the fact you would lose the seller account before you made the 500 sellers fee back.. If a package does not arrive for the most part its not a scam, packages can get lost, they can accidentally not be sent. Bear in mind most people doing this game are not professionals. They´re your regular peeps. some drug dealers, some just people with connections trying to do the best they can in a new market. People make mistakes, things get lost, the important thing is the professionalism used by a seller to put things right. I wish we had people with years of eCommerce skills helping us lol, but unfortunately the reality is a little bleaker, for the most part its just regular people setting up shop from home with a vac pack machine, a head full of good ideas and a lot of balls, trying to share with the world something they´re passionate about, and make some $$ whilst they do it. ;)    2 minutes    unread
delete

xxxxxx    Fair enough,
----I was just scammed by a vendor for something less then $5....


The Scurvy Crew 5.0    Why would you think we scam for such a low cost product when we send kilos of it out a day? Wouldn't it be more likley it is lost in the mail?
ACE

xxxxxx    It's been over a month and i never received anything was really looking forward to trying your tea out, sad that you scam for such a little amount of BC...

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Now My question is this, when did all of you newbies start to lose faith? Is it actually that theres more scamming going on? I doubt theres more scamming now than there was when it was back a year ago when it was virtually free to create a sellers account.. Or is it just the class of people that are signing up to buy drugs these days.. Maybe now that SR is so well known were getting the kind of people that could couldn't even complete a street deal coming to us as their only recourse to buy drugs, for the most part sellers are not here because they have to be, we can make the money elsewhere, were here because we love the job, the idea behind it and everything it comprises... I hope its not the case. I loved dealing with the customers back last summer, We regularly chatted to customers for months, fucking amazing people that wrote interesting messages, it was friendlier, now it just seems people expect us to work like the robots at Amazon.com, caving into their every demand and threat, or like were some ebay support staff, underpaid and dreaming away the minutes till we can finish the day.
The thing that pisses me off most is that I´ve seen two of these get into recent feedback, now that can´t be changed.. why the fuck would you accuse someone of scamming with absolutely no evidence, just based on the fact you didn't receive your package first time round and you weren´t given a 100% refund when you demanded it, it clearly says 50% refund, or reship on the fucking terms, if you don´t agree to the rules put in place here, email your online pharmacy and kindly explain to them that you would really like to be sent some opiates in the mail. Arghhh
OK rant over.
ACE
Title: Re: Silk Road Newbies and their constant fear of being scammed... :/
Post by: CabinBoyNathanial on September 10, 2013, 04:17 am
I am pretty new around here myself, and am currently working with a vendor that is recently being called a scammer. It is something that once you read it, it sticks in your brain. It could be that one pissed person (could even be another vendor) is using multiple identities to try to fuck this person over and ruin their business which until recently was very well reviewed. Add some FE requirement to certain items, and it combines to create a nice amount of paranoia. Why did I FE? Both vendors that carry the product required it, and it is something I wanted.

I am the type of person that likes to give the benefit of the doubt, and did so in my transaction. It has been longer than it should be for a package in my country to have gotten to me maybe even twice. I didn't want to just go crazy and fuck up their rep without knowing anything for certain, so tonight I sent them a message. I tried to be courteous, and told them that I was just wondering if they had any delays or whatever. I explained to them why I was contacting them, and that the recent negative posts toward them was making me a bit nervous. I let them know that if my package does arrive that I will let the whole of SR know and would post a good review etc. I let them know that if it does NOT arrive that I will consider it a lesson learned, and move on. There is enough negativity around their account recently and adding more really wouldn't be constructive. In the end, I just said to tell me if they weren't going to come through so I could chalk it up to experience and order from someone else so I can get my darn item haha.

There are a lot of posts around about vendors (and clients) being scammers. If you read enough of that, it can introduce some paranoia, and lead to irrational clients. I would like to think that the irrational clients that are being assholes are just that way all the time, and it is a shame that they are here fucking it up for the rest of us.

Sorry if this is a mass ramble, but I am trying to do too many things at once at the moment haha.
Title: Re: Silk Road Newbies and their constant fear of being scammed... :/
Post by: fuckingACE on September 10, 2013, 04:30 am
I guess it might be a case of paranoia feeding itself, in which case peeps need to be careful, its awful easy to ruin a reputation and awfully hard to build it back up. I´m all for scammers being exposed, a safe environment attracts more customers. But people in general need to go easy on accusations, O´ve seen so many old vendors being brought up into this recently with little or no evidence, just like court, you got to know for sure before you judge. Cause if they´re not a scammer and its just bad luck the package hasn´t arrived then you´re punishing someone for something thats out of their control.
ACE
Title: Re: Silk Road Newbies and their constant fear of being scammed... :/
Post by: murderface2012 on September 10, 2013, 06:48 am

you have every right to rant ACE!!
i truly believe some people forget where we are!!
this isn't amazon.com people!!
drugs are being sent via the postal system to our lovely drops..
error's WILL occur!!

patience newbers..
and communicate with respect for Shiva's sake!!
accusations, and quick conclusions will get you nowhere here!!
Title: Re: Silk Road Newbies and their constant fear of being scammed... :/
Post by: Cher on September 10, 2013, 07:19 am
totally agree... plus there has been such an influx of new users the last few weeks, almost half of our orders are coming from people with no stats. we ask them to FE by private message and it generally takes them 2-3 days to respond. most have no problem with this but it's fucking up our order flow completely!
if you're a newbie, expect to FE and check your inbox for updates from vendors, make sure you finalize!
the community is expanding, no doubt...
Title: Re: Silk Road Newbies and their constant fear of being scammed... :/
Post by: CabinBoyNathanial on September 10, 2013, 10:55 am
totally agree... plus there has been such an influx of new users the last few weeks, almost half of our orders are coming from people with no stats. we ask them to FE by private message and it generally takes them 2-3 days to respond. most have no problem with this but it's fucking up our order flow completely!
if you're a newbie, expect to FE and check your inbox for updates from vendors, make sure you finalize!
the community is expanding, no doubt...

I have been a lurker off and on for a long time, but only in the past couple months decided to become active.
I am sure you vendors are being crushed with n00blets placing orders and such. Unfortunately the barrier to entry to the Road these days is way lower than it used to be.

I am a buyer of small, personal amounts of mostly herb, but I log in every day to see what is going on and to see if I have any messages so I can reply to them. I check most of the forums, and dig being part of the community here.

It seems like there really should be an artificial barrier to entry put up now. Something along the lines of having to read the wiki and agree to certain this and that before you can get on the Road to start buying. That may help a little bit, but considering what we are all here for, some ignorant actions unfortunately are par for the course.
 
Title: Re: Silk Road Newbies and their constant fear of being scammed... :/
Post by: NoQuarter_merchant on September 10, 2013, 03:28 pm
I think a fear of being scammed is completely legitimate, except for the business we're all in.

It is any worse to go buy drugs in a parking lot?  A bar?  Invite the dealer into your house?   

No one is getting beat up and robbed here.  When they look at the alternatives, they don't have much choice.

People will always have a fear of getting ripped off, that's why you have to address it appropriately.    Identity problem buyers and eliminate them from your customer base.
Title: Re: Silk Road Newbies and their constant fear of being scammed... :/
Post by: Kalli on September 10, 2013, 03:43 pm

i truly believe some people forget where we are!!
this isn't amazon.com people!!

No but it is amazin.com ;)
Title: Re: Silk Road Newbies and their constant fear of being scammed... :/
Post by: gambino on September 10, 2013, 04:03 pm
Ace, I've been here 2 years, and it seems both buyers and sellers are less trusting today than a year ago.  Not sure exactly what's going on, but a lot sellers don't even trust buyers with good stats anymore.  Unfortunately, the good old SR days are gone.
Title: Re: Silk Road Newbies and their constant fear of being scammed... :/
Post by: fuckingACE on September 10, 2013, 09:06 pm
Its a shame, cause it runs the danger of having vendors begin to deal with only select customers. I think that once a seller reaches a certain stage with a large enough following that he can continue to grow successfully only through vetted direct referrals and people who have successfully transacted before. If it really does turn into a major problem, not saying that its anywhere near that yet, but its going in that direction now, why would large vendors bother taking new business if they could be sure to only deal with tried and trusted customers and still turn in a profit without the old hassle. Understand that percentage wise, newbies represent lower profits, at least for us, taking into account the higher rate if problems encountered per transaction, more time spent answering questions and badly written or marked feedback, and higher refund rates.. new vendors have no choice, you have do deal with that shit in order to survive here, but the well known vendors have the luxury of choosing and not really losing out on as much as you might think. 
 Personally I don´t understand it, If you´ve done what you should and researched the vendor you´re going to go with thoroughly there should be no point during the transaction in which you would say to yourself ·shit im being scammed". And if you don´t bother researching who you shop with then buying drugs really isnt what you should be doing, and even more so here. Its a stupid risk to buy something that could kill you from someone you have no faith in..
ACE
Title: Re: Silk Road Newbies and their constant fear of being scammed... :/
Post by: Mitch Kumstien on September 10, 2013, 09:34 pm
Being new you hear all the tales of caution and woe that fuel paranoia, but you can't go wrong doing things right. Yes every order is important, even a $5.00 order but to expect any vendor to be held accountable for anything other than what is in their power is unreasonable. A vendor, in this case ACE, packs up your product after you place your order and ships it off anything after that is out of the vendors hands. I am grateful to have vendors like you ACE that offer refunds and reships even when you are not directly at fault. I love vendors like The Scurvy Crew that keep it honest, and that deserves to be reciprocated.

I had one package take 25 days during the time where ACE and TSC were experiencing problems with his staff and ACE reshipped after about 18 days, 7 days later I receive my letter. I however did give ACE my word that if the, what I presumed to be, lost package did arrive that I would pay for that package as well. About another 7 days later a surprise in my mail box. I contacted ACE, he wrote a recovery ticket and I placed my next order. This order had its share of delays with ACE and TSC taking vacation, and the restaffing, it took like 10 days to process but 14 days from when it was shipped it arrived safe and sound. During these two orders I had my share of worries due to delays and contacted ACE, who kept the lines of communication open; he would track my package and give me updates upon request. The reason I bring all this up is that you can rest assured that you are not dealing with scammers when dealing with ACE and The Scurvy Crew, just professionals in what they do. If you communicate correctly with ACE, i.e. not firing off accusations at him and TSC of scamming you before making an honest effort to resolve any situation that arises I feel you will be fine.

That's how I feel about it anyways. ACE and The Scurvy Crew do come through. Thanks for that!
Title: Re: Silk Road Newbies and their constant fear of being scammed... :/
Post by: FollowIcculus on September 10, 2013, 09:48 pm
Vendors should have a constant fear of being scammed by newbies.  I have never been scammed.  Not when I was new 2 years ago and not since.  Never.
Title: Re: Silk Road Newbies and their constant fear of being scammed... :/
Post by: Meerkovo on September 10, 2013, 11:16 pm
   Well one thing for sure, is a buyer can make a new account, every minute load btc and scam vendors on a daily basis, however most of the time, it's not even Newbies, I have a feeling it's vendors setting up these accounts and trying it on with rival vendors, they pretty much know how it works and do it to piss you off! Anyway, we always give newbies the benefit of the doubt, only some, sometimes tend to scare us though.

We weclome you newbies!


Meerkovo
Title: Re: Silk Road Newbies and their constant fear of being scammed... :/
Post by: Isobetadine on September 10, 2013, 11:56 pm
Ace, I've been here 2 years, and it seems both buyers and sellers are less trusting today than a year ago.  Not sure exactly what's going on, but a lot sellers don't even trust buyers with good stats anymore.  Unfortunately, the good old SR days are gone.

It's easier to trust a niche crowd.
Expension brings more competition.

There are some that believe competition and freemarket by itself will create utopia ::).
Well more competition can brings good as well as bad.
Underhanded tricks where both buyers and vendors in cahoots attack other vendors.
Vendor on vendor crime:D.
HELL,the best example: buyersmarket on buyersmarket crime.
Have you seen the new vendor accounts with only atlantis links in their listings.
Cheeky isn't.  ;D

Problem is that negativity has more impact on our brains.(this is a scientific fact btw)
So with expansion,yes vendors could deal with more scamming but when looking at it in terms of percentage there will probably not be a dramatic increase.
Title: Re: Silk Road Newbies and their constant fear of being scammed... :/
Post by: Isobetadine on September 11, 2013, 12:25 am
If you are a legitimate or correct vendor i can understand the personal rant.
Shows you're only human and that is something buyers should never ever forget.

But that's what this is..a PERSONAL rant applicable to only your personal circumstance as a vendor.
Not all vendors are legit or correct.

It's the way of the world eversince we started trading stuff for other stuff.
Talk to other people in business on how to make customercare smoother,pick up a book about??


you have every right to rant ACE!!
i truly believe some people forget where we are!!
this isn't amazon.com people!!
drugs are being sent via the postal system to our lovely drops..
error's WILL occur!!

patience newbers..
and communicate with respect for Shiva's sake!!
accusations, and quick conclusions will get you nowhere here!!

On amazon.com if you get scammed there are propper channels to resolve situations.
Worst case scenario's complaints..
Extreme worst scenario cases when you buy via a webshop you can settle things by taking legal actions.

Due to the nature of the product it is accually VERY easy to get scammed.
Even when buying legal products for consumption it is easy to get scammed.
But there are/should be authorities to monitor the trade and once again there are propper channels for complaints.

Not the case here.
Thanks to the amazing "war on drugs",buyers are at the merçy of the vendor and SR management.
This applies to the "receiving the package"-aspect of the business as well as the advertized quality of the package.
(Some vendors are at the mercy of their suppliers when it comes to the quality or contents their products.That's where test labs come into play but that's another debate.)

I love SR just as much as most of us here but that does not mean you should stop critical thinking and only go into kissing ass-mode.
That's not helping so think before you fanboy.
Leave the "love is blind" attitude for the human interactions in the pursuit of fornication: :P.

I think a fear of being scammed is completely legitimate, except for the business we're all in.

It is any worse to go buy drugs in a parking lot?  A bar?  Invite the dealer into your house?   

No one is getting beat up and robbed here.  When they look at the alternatives, they don't have much choice.

People will always have a fear of getting ripped off, that's why you have to address it appropriately.    Identity problem buyers and eliminate them from your customer base.

Could not have said it better.
+1
Yes you "could" get new accounts but many vendors are smart enough to pamper their longtime customers.

One of the ideas behind Silk Road is to take the REAL criminal aspect out of the the drug business,to organize it and make it decent.
This means vendors should organize just like entrepreneurs dealing in legal markets and operate from a real business model.

///Which means  thinking about expansion of your customerbase for one thing.
I mean common Cher,a businessman/businesswoman complaining about that... say whaaaat??:o ///

And just like regular entrepreneurs customer care is a VERY important task.
I realize customers can be a pain but that falls under job hazards.

Business is not just a way to make quick easy money.
It takes alot of work,organisation and patience,especially the human interactions part like ACE here teaches us ;).

***So think about it before heading into this branch everybody out there.Check if you have the correct personality type to survive and more important-> thrive in it.***
Title: Re: Silk Road Newbies and their constant fear of being scammed... :/
Post by: MrJoshua on September 11, 2013, 12:37 am
I think a lot of this comes from SR becoming more mainstream. Ever read the reddit/r/silkroad subforum? It's non-stop buyers calling everyone and anyone a selective scammer for almost any reason.

The irony is selective scamming is the worst business model for a vendor. The better bet is to ship like crazy and gun for as many 5/5s as you can and then break bad. Nobody selective scams anymore, if it was really ever done in force at all.

It's just buyers venting because they're used to ordering shit off Amazon and eBay and don't realize how much different this is.