Silk Road forums
Support => Feature requests => Topic started by: winterjacket1 on May 05, 2012, 11:47 pm
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I believe in the wind-sail-boat analogy. Your life is a boat, the sails are your emotions, and drugs are the wind. When you're a kid, your boat is small and your sail is huge, and drugs are like a hurricane. So you need to get to a point in life where you have a big enough boat to navigate the weather
I'm no religious zealot nor a hardcore libertarian - but I do know science says your neurons stop growing at 21, at that point I think they are fair game to be massacred.
Finances seem to be the most likely safety valve, but even a disclaimer would be enough to show that the site has some moral conscience.
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I believe in the wind-sail-boat analogy. Your life is a boat, the sails are your emotions, and drugs are the wind. When you're a kid, your boat is small and your sail is huge, and drugs are like a hurricane. So you need to get to a point in life where you have a big enough boat to navigate the weather
I'm no religious zealot nor a hardcore libertarian - but I do know science says your neurons stop growing at 21, at that point I think they are fair game to be massacred.
Finances seem to be the most likely safety valve, but even a disclaimer would be enough to show that the site has some moral conscience.
If a kid figures out how to get to the road, convert cash to btc, and have the products delivered successfully to his hands then by all means he deserves to do it. I think the streets are way more dangerous than SR in terms of influencing kids to do drugs and just more sketchy overall. I honestly can't really see a kid do all that work to buy heroin or something relatively strong but instead maybe to buy weed.
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I believe in the wind-sail-boat analogy. Your life is a boat, the sails are your emotions, and drugs are the wind. When you're a kid, your boat is small and your sail is huge, and drugs are like a hurricane. So you need to get to a point in life where you have a big enough boat to navigate the weather
I'm no religious zealot nor a hardcore libertarian - but I do know science says your neurons stop growing at 21, at that point I think they are fair game to be massacred.
Finances seem to be the most likely safety valve, but even a disclaimer would be enough to show that the site has some moral conscience.
If a kid figures out how to get to the road, convert cash to btc, and have the products delivered successfully to his hands then by all means he deserves to do it.
You're seriously exaggerating how hard a Silk Road transaction is. Literally every single step of the process is automated or otherwise explained clearly and simply to you as you do it - the only part you have to figure out is the existence of Silk Road. Hell, you could even Google "drugs online" or something simple like that.
You find out about Silk Road. How do I get there? Oh, I need Tor. You download it and it's good to go for most purposes. You get to Silk Road and find out you need Bitcoins. You Google bitcoins and you get thousands of results, Mt. Gox being the fourth. How do you fund Mt. Gox? There are dozens of ways, all of which are explained clearly on Mt. Gox itself, or are otherwise accessible on the Internet. Then you transfer your funds to Silk Road.
Not the most secure way to do it, but the process is simple. It's baffling to me every time someone justifies something with the difficulty of Silk Road. It is extremely simple and your hand is held the whole way.
Though I do agree with your point that young'ns would probably only use the Road for weed, which is fine by me. I would be fine with my kid doing weed once he seemed to be mature enough, for most people that's not the case. If a kid can get everything past their parents, then hey, that's a fuck da police kind of deal.
I'm 12 what is this.
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Genghar most of what you said is true except for the fact that a kid really doesn't have a bank acccount so I wonder how he would link transactions into MT GOX he is more likely to get a MP and just buy BTC on here in my opinion.
And the OP is wrong nuerons do not stop growing at the age of 21 and science is unclear as to if they ever really stop growing. They might just grow at a much slower rate as we age.
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Genghar most of what you said is true except for the fact that a kid really doesn't have a bank acccount so I wonder how he would link transactions into MT GOX he is more likely to get a MP and just buy BTC on here in my opinion.
Mt. Gox. Add funds. Cash deposit. Follow instructions.
It's what I did to figure everything out and do this dirty dance anonymously.
Though I'd agree that the prospect of having everything done for you is attractive.
Oh, kiddies! If you're reading this, please know that the Bitcoin vendors are charging you a ridiculous markup. $6.50 a coin vs +5% or so a coin the way I do it. But, there's something to be said for the huge anonymity that vendors allow you. Hmmm.
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Your neurons are yours to massacre, regardless of your age. No five year old would have the mental capacity or the interest to figure any of this shit out, and even if they did nobody would allow them to actually deposit money at a bank. The whole 18 or older rule is completely arbitrary, people grow at different speeds. If you are old enough to be interested in drugs, to find silkroad and walk into a bank without anyone questioning wtf you are doing there you are old enough to make your own decisions.
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Genghar most of what you said is true except for the fact that a kid really doesn't have a bank acccount so I wonder how he would link transactions into MT GOX he is more likely to get a MP and just buy BTC on here in my opinion.
Mt. Gox. Add funds. Cash deposit. Follow instructions.
It's what I did to figure everything out and do this dirty dance anonymously.
Though I'd agree that the prospect of having everything done for you is attractive.
Oh, kiddies! If you're reading this, please know that the Bitcoin vendors are charging you a ridiculous markup. $6.50 a coin vs +5% or so a coin the way I do it. But, there's something to be said for the huge anonymity that vendors allow you. Hmmm.
I still don't think a lot of kids are even on SR and even if they were you already pointed out that they probably only buy weed and small amounts too. Besides I thought this was the free market?
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Besides I thought this was the free market?
I said scant nothing about morality or control of the market, bud. Just talked about the reality of using Silk Road.
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Besides I thought this was the free market?
I said scant nothing about morality or control of the market, bud. Just talked about the reality of using Silk Road.
True, then I'll direct that question to the OP :D
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I agree with both you, OP, and Delta. It really depends on the kid doing it. All in all, it takes kids away from the street, which to me is a great thing.
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Genghar most of what you said is true except for the fact that a kid really doesn't have a bank acccount so I wonder how he would link transactions into MT GOX he is more likely to get a MP and just buy BTC on here in my opinion.
Mt. Gox. Add funds. Cash deposit. Follow instructions.
It's what I did to figure everything out and do this dirty dance anonymously.
Though I'd agree that the prospect of having everything done for you is attractive.
Oh, kiddies! If you're reading this, please know that the Bitcoin vendors are charging you a ridiculous markup. $6.50 a coin vs +5% or so a coin the way I do it. But, there's something to be said for the huge anonymity that vendors allow you. Hmmm.
I still don't think a lot of kids are even on SR and even if they were you already pointed out that they probably only buy weed and small amounts too. Besides I thought this was the free market?
I posted this topic originally to generate discussion in light of recent criticism of SR as an easy way for minors to acquire drugs.
Say what you will about competent young kids buying weed or worse on SR. But it tarnishes the reputation of the site as an example of a responsible free market. There probably isn't any way to fix this, and probably why LE will never leave sites like this alone.
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My opinion is--blame the parents, not SR. That is--if you're looking to blame someone for something.
Personally, I think that the ratio of "children" to "adults" who are active members on this site is tiny, if it even exists. I've never heard any news stories or anecdotes that directly linked drug-use in children to dark web drug scenes. That with the fact that no one on here knows anything about anyone else on here, least of all a persons age, makes me think this is kind of a non-issue.
Like others have said, if a "child" has the resources, initiative, and motivation to complete a transaction top to bottom on Silk Road without any issues, then what's the harm? Chances are--if they ended up doing that, then they already had their hand in the "drug business" prior to even knowing what Silk Road was. I doubt any naive child, who had never used drugs, would read a Wired article about Silk Road, and think "hmm I'm going to get started right now! I've never used drugs but that looks damned easy!!"
Not saying irresponsible drug use isn't a problem--it is, and children typically are the embodiment of irresponsibility--I just think that family dynamics need to play a hand in keeping kids off of this site. If you have children, watch, or even limit, what they do on the internet. It's a basic mandate in this day and age of parenting and technology. If you let your children use the internet unrestricted and unmonitored, they will find new sources of influence other than you, and you won't be able to gain that back once that door is open.
Responsible drug use definitely comes second to responsible parenting!
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I believe in the wind-sail-boat analogy. Your life is a boat, the sails are your emotions, and drugs are the wind. When you're a kid, your boat is small and your sail is huge, and drugs are like a hurricane. So you need to get to a point in life where you have a big enough boat to navigate the weather
I'm no religious zealot nor a hardcore libertarian - but I do know science says your neurons stop growing at 21, at that point I think they are fair game to be massacred.
Finances seem to be the most likely safety valve, but even a disclaimer would be enough to show that the site has some moral conscience.
If a kid figures out how to get to the road, convert cash to btc, and have the products delivered successfully to his hands then by all means he deserves to do it. I think the streets are way more dangerous than SR in terms of influencing kids to do drugs and just more sketchy overall. I honestly can't really see a kid do all that work to buy heroin or something relatively strong but instead maybe to buy weed.
I agree as long as people act mature / over 21, and don't admit they are under that age it's all good.
And there would be no possible way to stop anyone under 21 getting here and buying drugs.
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My opinion is--blame the parents, not SR. That is--if you're looking to blame someone for something.
Personally, I think that the ratio of "children" to "adults" who are active members on this site is tiny, if it even exists. I've never heard any news stories or anecdotes that directly linked drug-use in children to dark web drug scenes. That with the fact that no one on here knows anything about anyone else on here, least of all a persons age, makes me think this is kind of a non-issue.
Like others have said, if a "child" has the resources, initiative, and motivation to complete a transaction top to bottom on Silk Road without any issues, then what's the harm? Chances are--if they ended up doing that, then they already had their hand in the "drug business" prior to even knowing what Silk Road was. I doubt any naive child, who had never used drugs, would read a Wired article about Silk Road, and think "hmm I'm going to get started right now! I've never used drugs but that looks damned easy!!"
Not saying irresponsible drug use isn't a problem--it is, and children typically are the embodiment of irresponsibility--I just think that family dynamics need to play a hand in keeping kids off of this site. If you have children, watch, or even limit, what they do on the internet. It's a basic mandate in this day and age of parenting and technology. If you let your children use the internet unrestricted and unmonitored, they will find new sources of influence other than you, and you won't be able to gain that back once that door is open.
Responsible drug use definitely comes second to responsible parenting!
I think the harm is when a Mom/Dad opens up a package, if that happens enough times it certainly puts the vendor/SR at some risk. There will be those quick to argue that the system in and of itself protects the vendor enough and SR enough (anonymity wise) that this wouldn't be an issue. However if it were to happen enough though, it would just give LEO more motivation to come after the site, the ability to collect information on the locale of certain vendors (assuming the kid drops names of vendors and that it makes it to the police). I'm not saying that kids should/shouldn't be on SR, that's something I have mixed feelings on.
Another scenario that would jeopardize SR is one where a few kids get rolls, Tony Montona , or some gear, (any drug that kill you if you take too much) , one of them overdoses, and during the investigation one of the kids cops out and says they got it from SR. of course its gonna be that kids move to because he still doesn't have to say from whom, he doesn't know anyways ! But then there would be a huge 6 o'clock news piece leading to a national 60 minutes type thing. " Online market allows kids to get access to drugs they never would be able to, 1 kid dead" kind of thing. That would really fucking suck.
Really though there's nothing DPR/community could do make the site for adults only, let alone the fact putting such a restriction or defining "kid", that would stand against the free market he and the majority of us here on the road espouse.
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I really don't think it's possible to prevent kids (as in people under 21 - I think most are right in assuming your average 5 year old wouldn't be interested) coming to places like this. I remember being a teenager since it was such a recent occurrence in my life, I don't think anything would have stopped me if this kind of thing had been around.
Also I am pretty sure that you can have a bank account as a child/teen I always had one back then, got my first when I was 11. In fact the bank transfer aspect actually makes it easier for kids, the credit card is what you can't get till you are 18 and debit cards for young people are on more restrictive formats (no visa or mastercard).
But kids can go hang with sketchy dealers and score drugs on the street, they do so every day, and if we are referring to all people under 21 as kids I can assure you that they are not restricting themselves to weed. Like it or not. I admit that I probably did a lot of harm to myself (specifically setting myself up for long term problems with addiction) by experimenting at too young of an age when my neural circuitry was still highly flexible, but I did it anyway, without the help of the internet (well... without this kind of help anyway).
The whole "but it gives an excuse to destroy SR" thing is kind of a weird argument, SR is already an affront to people who feel that way, they don't need an excuse, equally there are plenty of people over 21 who still live with their parents and whose parents disapprove of their activities and would be just as willing to scream "wont someone think of the children" even if their children were in their early 30s. Likewise stupid, impulsive, ignorant and reckless people can be found among all age brackets and cause problems for others as a result.
However it is impossible to specifically restrict an anonymous audience by age anyway, so it's kind of a moot point, unless you go with the disclaimer idea in which case it is just kind of a laughable act of hypocrisy.
An alternative that might have some merit is a warning explaining precisely the fact that the brain is still developing to people under certain ages and that the risks of addiction and similar are statistically demonstrable to be significantly higher when the age of drug exposure is during adolescence than when it is older and let people, young and old, make their own minds up from an educated perspective (after all I never learned about that sort of thing until it was way too late, the idea that there were dangers specific to my stage of development was something I was too immature to conceive and that no-one sought to impress on me).
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Genghar most of what you said is true except for the fact that a kid really doesn't have a bank acccount so I wonder how he would link transactions into MT GOX he is more likely to get a MP and just buy BTC on here in my opinion.
And the OP is wrong nuerons do not stop growing at the age of 21 and science is unclear as to if they ever really stop growing. They might just grow at a much slower rate as we age.
In the UK you can have a bank account almost from born.
And one that allows withdraws at atm's at 13, and online!
I make around 200$+ a day through LR, so I don't even involve a bank account EVER, it's more anonymous this way.
I then could buy drugs and sell "in real life", to cashout my money.
Therefor your statement is invalid.
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I know quite a few people under 18 who use SR.
In my opinion, it's equally as dangerous to buy sketchy stuff off the streets just because you're 16 and desperate to try it. For example, I (stupidly) started using MDMA at 14. When I think back to what my little friends and I had to go through to get those sketchy, crumbly little pills, it scares me. I took so many pills that I thought were MDMA but turned out to be horrible for me....
At least on Silk Road, you know what you're getting. The products are clean, you know if your vendor is to be trusted.
If you're a minor and can get packages past your parents, and you're not a total dumb ass with privacy and taking the drugs, then I say go for it! At least you wont run the risk of snorting crushed up glass and getting shanked.
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I believe in the wind-sail-boat analogy. Your life is a boat, the sails are your emotions, and drugs are the wind. When you're a kid, your boat is small and your sail is huge, and drugs are like a hurricane. So you need to get to a point in life where you have a big enough boat to navigate the weather
I'm no religious zealot nor a hardcore libertarian - but I do know science says your neurons stop growing at 21, at that point I think they are fair game to be massacred.
Finances seem to be the most likely safety valve, but even a disclaimer would be enough to show that the site has some moral conscience.
are you mad? Don't call your campaign "Keep kids away from SR" it'll make us a magnet for the little shits. Call it something like 'Parents campaign for the inclusion of children in the Silk Road educational community." They'll run a mile.
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I`m against this campaign and believe if kids arrive here we must do the best to educate them, and trade/buy/sell/use safely. Time after time we see mistakes made in the past. Prohibition, the war on drugs, the birth of police-states. We should teach kids as responsible parents would. We can`t stop them from coming here, but we can do the right thing by teaching them right from wrong with our experience. Of course I`d prefer if they were somewhat older and more responsible enough to comprehend and make the right decisions, unfortunately again as any kid thinks at their age, they think they are more mature. We can only guide and count on them to becoming responsible thing way. Kids always pose a risk to themselves, their relatives, others, even businesses like this. Then again even adults do the same.
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You're seriously exaggerating how hard a Silk Road transaction is. Literally every single step of the process is automated or otherwise explained clearly and simply to you as you do it - the only part you have to figure out is the existence of Silk Road.
If that is true then why are there so many people who can not seem to figure it out? They post questions like "How do I get bit coin?", "How do I do xxxx?", "Can I use something other than PGP?", and they can not follow simple instructions on a vendors page?
It may be simple once you get it all figured out but it seems that many adults are having trouble with it.
My opinion is--blame the parents, not SR. That is--if you're looking to blame someone for something.
I agree, I raised my kids to know what drugs were and to understand that they are for adults. It is the parents job to make sure there kid is ready for the world and the world is full of things like drugs.
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If the boat is your life, the sails are your emotions and wind is the drugs. Then the anchor must be LE, and the sea is Tor with the waves as Bitcoins ??? ;D
Maybe the ships mate is your vendor, no wait, the islands are the vendors. Yeh, and Roger the cabin boy is the postman...*thinking*... the captain must be... Dread Pirate Roberts!!
And who's that friendly parrot on his shoulder, well it must be Limetless. ;)
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I started using SR when I was 16 and it's really a great thing to have access to. Instead of dealing with sketchy drug addicts to get whatever drugs I want in person and potentially getting robbed or getting complete shit for product I am able to safely get drugs that I know are good drugs and I know I'm not going to get robbed over an oz.
Isn't the whole point of SR to give people access to things the government deem people incapable of handling responsibly, so how would it be any different for the people of silkroad to say 'children' can't handle their drugs responsibly its more or less doing the same thing that the people of SR are working against.
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I started using SR when I was 16 and it's really a great thing to have access to. Instead of dealing with sketchy drug addicts to get whatever drugs I want in person and potentially getting robbed or getting complete shit for product I am able to safely get drugs that I know are good drugs and I know I'm not going to get robbed over an oz.
Isn't the whole point of SR to give people access to things the government deem people incapable of handling responsibly, so how would it be any different for the people of silkroad to say 'children' can't handle their drugs responsibly its more or less doing the same thing that the people of SR are working against.
+1.
Structure was a bit confusing but it got the point across.
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Fuck it, the more dead kids the better! I love whacking off to pictues of dead children!!!!
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Fuck it, the more dead kids the better! I love whacking off to pictues of dead children!!!!
:( No.
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I think it's noble what OP is saying, but it's kind of the same argument as saying more people will smoke weed if it's legalized.
It's also pretty futile. Show me one 17-year old who got the homepage of Brazzers, read the 18+ warning, and clicked no. Same thing.
Also, THAT kid would need drugs.
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Why would you want to keep kids away from SR? they deserve to have access to top quality drugs just as much as you.
Lol your posts crack me up
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There's no way you can identify children. Sure you can make SR less user friendly, but the smart kids who want drugs will almost always be able to find them.