Silk Road forums
Discussion => Drug safety => Topic started by: The Scientist on January 06, 2013, 09:14 am
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if so what did you use and what dose?
Did they decrease social anxiety?
was it obvious you were on them or did you function normally?
I've never used opiates.
Amphetamines don't do shit for me any more.
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I'm a rather shy person and opiates, H, does reduce that and the associated anxiety, but I have never used it for that purpose , nor benzos. It is very easy at first before you get a tolerance to be a gouched out mumbling extrovert without even realising. You think you are functioning, then you pick up on the funny looks and suddenly your work colleagues are avoiding you like the plague! Lol. Those are the understanding ones, the others are busy in the office getting you sacked! Drugs should be for enjoyment only, using them as a prop is the quick route to addiction. Lol, 25 years later, I've got my chronic habit down to once a fortnight- as a treat. Not a good idea for most users though, you have to have very strong will and know yourself well- triggers etc. Otherwise that chipping becomes more and more often. It creeps up on you so easily. So, in conclusion, no, not a good idea!
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never taken them directly for anxiety no, bupe does have a great anti anxiety effect, but certainly not worth taking it for that purpose.
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I'm a rather shy person and opiates, H, does reduce that and the associated anxiety, but I have never used it for that purpose , nor benzos. It is very easy at first before you get a tolerance to be a gouched out mumbling extrovert without even realising. You think you are functioning, then you pick up on the funny looks and suddenly your work colleagues are avoiding you like the plague! Lol. Those are the understanding ones, the others are busy in the office getting you sacked! Drugs should be for enjoyment only, using them as a prop is the quick route to addiction. Lol, 25 years later, I've got my chronic habit down to once a fortnight- as a treat. Not a good idea for most users though, you have to have very strong will and know yourself well- triggers etc. Otherwise that chipping becomes more and more often. It creeps up on you so easily. So, in conclusion, no, not a good idea!
Maybe other opiates would work better than heroin?
I'm not too concerned about addiction. I have good self-control. I've used meth, cocaine, Adderall, and other drugs for social anxiety, and have never became addicted to any of them. Unfortunately, they are no longer as effective as they used to be in treating the symptoms of social anxiety.
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opiates can help with anxiety somewhat, especially the first couple times you use the, but they are not really good for that purpose, if you are already an anxious person opiates can tend to make you're anxiety worse. And like with pretty much everything, it will lose effectiveness if you keep using it for that and will only make you're anxiety worse in the end.
Have you every gotten any treatment for you're anxiety? Therapy and antidepressants can help, I used to take paxil for anxiety, it worked wonders but I had to stop taking it cause it was killing my penis =/ lol. I take remeron now and it works pretty well.
Believe me though, self medicating for anxiety works well at first, but in the end it will only make you're anxiety problems worse, I guarantee it.
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opiates can help with anxiety somewhat, especially the first couple times you use the, but they are not really good for that purpose, if you are already an anxious person opiates can tend to make you're anxiety worse. And like with pretty much everything, it will lose effectiveness if you keep using it for that and will only make you're anxiety worse in the end.
Have you every gotten any treatment for you're anxiety? Therapy and antidepressants can help, I used to take paxil for anxiety, it worked wonders but I had to stop taking it cause it was killing my penis =/ lol. I take remeron now and it works pretty well.
Believe me though, self medicating for anxiety works well at first, but in the end it will only make you're anxiety problems worse, I guarantee it.
Thanks for the info.
Do you suffer from social anxiety?
Which opiates have you used, and did you use them specifically for social anxiety?
You know, people said the same thing to me about meth and cocaine -- that it does eliminate social anxiety, but it isn't 'worth it'. Yeah, if you get addicted, it isn't worth it, but I never got addicted to those drugs, and in retrospect I'd say it was worth it. I made friends, got a girlfriend, etc. In hindsight I'm glad I tried these drugs, but for other people there is definitely a high risk of addiction.
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Have you every gotten any treatment for you're anxiety? Therapy and antidepressants can help, I used to take paxil for anxiety, it worked wonders but I had to stop taking it cause it was killing my penis =/ lol. I take remeron now and it works pretty well.
Believe me though, self medicating for anxiety works well at first, but in the end it will only make you're anxiety problems worse, I guarantee it.
That is a bit contradictory though. If you seek medical help, you will be prescribed SSRI's, that will have its side effects on your sex life as you illustrated.
The only alternative is to self medicate, which you guarantee to worsen the problem.
Combined these statements leave people with no option at all.
To be this is not satisfactory advise as it leaves people optionless. I'd rather suggest using something like 1 mg xanax and see how it affects your anxiety and social interaction. even just once or twice. This may prove to be a solution requiring no further medical meddling, and if it does not, the door to your doctors office is as open as it was before trying, with the added knowledge that benzo's are not effective for you.
As far as taking opiates against anxiety goes, it'd consider that a very last resort.
Opiates will prove very effective, but also very addictive. I would consider more mildly solutioms first, as they can make a huge difference without driving you into an addiction spiral per se.
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Good replies are already here but I'll add my own opinion too.
I ramble so I'm going to put a quick summary here and hope you read the rest
Drugs in general--fun and great but consider talk therapy(CBT) at least because it may be worth it.
Benzos: Good! Try .5mg xanax at first, dissolve it under your tongue or swallow it(I think the tongue method works a little faster) and see if you notice the effects. If not, try to break for a couple days before trying 1mg and do the same thing. The anxiolytic effects are subtle. You shouldn't need to get the physical drunkeness of benzos to feel the anxiety reduction.
Opiates: Good! Try 5mg hydrocodone at first, either chew/dissolve it or swallow it again and see how you feel. The effects here will become tolerated by your body quickly so be careful in how often you dose. Also, for best results take on an empty stomach.
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The rest:
One: I agree about using benzos. I have social anxiety and benzos are great to help deal with some of that. The problem is, addictive personality or not (like you, I can enjoy things like meth and simply put my foot down on any desires to do more), your tolerance will go up. Some benzos, off the top of my head I believe alprazolam (xanax) may not cause tolerance to build in regards to the anxiolytic effects. There are probably others with similar attributes that state the same thing. I try not to use them often enough to test that tolerance theory because it's much easier for tolerance to go up then down.
Two: The opiates. I've never had a steady supply of opiates (too expensive for me to by them through SR unless I want to spoil myself). That said, I have played with dosages and there is a level of opiates that got me feeling much less anxious and much more sociable. If you've never taken opiates, I'd suggest 5mg hydrocodone and see how that makes you feel. Don't worry about going anywhere when first experimenting (if you can afford to sacrifice a few tabs to find your comfort dosage) and just relax. I've found that taking opiates while relaxing alone will usually make me want to chat with people: suddenly I'm texting, calling, chatting, etc. Again, the problem is the quick tolerance buildup.
I'd also suggest considering talk therapy and see if that provides some benefit. I'm averse to anti-depressants but I know it can help some people. If you want to consider it, maybe it'll help. The talk therapy, specifically if it's CBT-oriented (and most is) may provide lasting improvement without drug use.
That said, on the drug side my advice would be to experiment with low doses of benzos and opiates, alternating days when you need them (and try to need them as seldom as possible unless you got the funds to keep yourself comfortable).
Cheers,
Snoopish
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I don't suggest opiates for any anxiety really, since they're so habit forming. While I know marijuana can cause more anxiety depending on the person, where it's done, etc, I still think it would be the best choice if you're looking for a substance to help. However, therapy can help as well. Talk to your doctor about it, he may know something we can't answer here. Sorry to hear you have an issue though :(.
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I don't suggest opiates for any anxiety really, since they're so habit forming. While I know marijuana can cause more anxiety depending on the person, where it's done, etc, I still think it would be the best choice if you're looking for a substance to help. However, therapy can help as well. Talk to your doctor about it, he may know something we can't answer here. Sorry to hear you have an issue though :(.
Solid suggestion and don't know why I didn't think to add that. For me, weed has been rather...hit or miss in terms of anxiety but a lot of what you get from weed depends on quality/strain, etc and I've yet to really settle on a source for a product that consistently gives me what I want out of it. If OP does some research, I would second the notion of trying to use weed as an option. Just be careful of smell and red-eyes and you should be able to function under the radar around others.
Opiates and benzo dosaging might be easier to hide any external effects when compared to weed but, in terms of prices and harm reduction, if you are looking for an anxiolytic drug weed really is the best first choice.
Cheers,
Snoopish
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It also depends on your environment, for instance if you smoke weed and become paranoid you're going to be arrested, that will only make matters worse :P.
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use xanax..
it will make you do some crazy shit tho..
that is if you abuse it..
if you can take it how it should be taken and ONLY when you will be going to a social enviorment or whatever then do it
it works ..
opiates will get you hooked fast..
they do work tho.. idk i just rather be me man.. like fuck it if im socially awkward then whatever.. fuck it thats me im done trying to please people. Be yourself..
get comfortable with yourself and just do you man..
drugs to be social is not a good thing.. its like tricking your mind.. your not really like that.. YOUR NOT.. the drugs are making you something your not for a short period of time..
BE ONE WITH YOURSELF MY YOUNG FRIEND
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@kryptoz: Haha. Also true. That kind of paranoia :o hasn't been really common for me but definitely is something to consider. Honestly, with any three of these drugs just dose small and carefully.
(especially weed: if you just blaze through a joint of really good weed and show up with bloodshot eyes and reek, it's not going to matter how much social anxiety you just overcame. The eyes will be a dead giveaway for most. I don't have enough experience to say how much would be a "safe" amount of weed to smoke before engaging in the social life).
Do you have an idea of how often you plan to use the anxiolytic drug of choice, OP? I'd suggest coming up with a general plan and keep with it (ex: 15mg hydro + 3mg xanax for the week) or however makes it easier to keep yourself safe. Just make sure you give every alternative (including the non-drug options) proper consideration.
@thelorax: You make a good point about coming to grips with who you are. That's the kind of thing talk therapy (quality CBT anyways) would go into and have him address these issues in his life. However, that may not be something he can or will do (majority of people could benefit from a little talk therapy but it's something I've ducked too so...stones, houses, etc.). So, in lieu of that option, may as well provide some guidelines for self-medicating. As much as I hate to admit it: I'm pretty sure none of my messages encompassing my entire internet career had any real impact on changing a person's mind. The next best thing in my book is hope they'll experiment carefully. I hope I've helped much more in that regard.
Anywho...rambling. I got a book that wants reading.
Cheers,
Snoopish
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Err opiates and benzos to tackle this seems quite extreme. Why not get a script for propranolol or something like that before you try habit forming drugs?
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Drugs in general--fun and great but consider talk therapy(CBT) at least because it may be worth it.
This. I had quite severe social anxiety back in the days, tried many different drugs to solve the problem but none was entirely satisfying. For instance, people would notice if I was coked up or I couldn't drink whenever I was on benzos. The main problem with drugs is that they get quickly addictive when they are used to solve a big issue. So I finally gave up my struggle and went to seek the help of a therapist, and she cured me in less than a year.
Otherwise, I also recommend going to Peru for at least two weeks and have some ayahuasca sessions. Ayahuasca will give you what you need and show you the path to take.
edit: oh and btw, SSRIs are shit. Just my two cents.
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I haven't read anything here. Just responding to the topic question:
Yes I did. And it caused more trouble and money than it was worth it.
Best method is exposure. Otherwise benzo's, but be very careful to not become addicted because withdrawal is sicker than sick. Probably the same goes for opiate withdrawal. Probably worse.
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Virmo makes a good point and one that I don't think has been explicitly stated: this will not work indefinitely. Best way to manage any sort of self-medication would be both as-needed and more of a buffer than a crutch. What I mean by that is to have your dose familiarized that you can use it for particularly stressful events but otherwise use the confidence of knowing you have a back-up plan to deal with the anxiety. For me, the knowledge of knowing I have the power to help myself in a dire straight helps me more than actually using that power.
Cheers,
Snoopish.
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It is not intended to work indefinitely, nor will it be the sole method of treating social anxiety. I also won't be using opiates every day -- once a month at most. All I needed to know is whether or not they are effective in reducing or eliminating social anxiety. I appreciate the sound advice, but most of it isn't applicable to me.
The reason I won't take benzos is because of their health profile. Although I have in the past, I won't take any drug that has the slightest chance of reducing my cognitive ability, memory, etc. I won't take a carcinogen, and many benzos are carcinogen.
Unless you overdose, opiates seem to have no negative effect on the brain. Unlike MDMA and benzos, I can use them once a month without worrying about how it might effect my cognitive performance in the future
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Heroin turns me into a social fucking butterfly. I am a pretty normal person and have a pretty normal social life but damn.. when I do some good dope I will talk about anything with anyone pretty much. I wouldn't use it for anxiety alone though.
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Some benzos, off the top of my head I believe alprazolam (xanax) may not cause tolerance to build in regards to the anxiolytic effects. There are probably others with similar attributes that state the same thing. I try not to use them often enough to test that tolerance theory because it's much easier for tolerance to go up then down.
That is something you need to consider for yourself. No tolerance has been demonstrated for the anxiolytic side of xanax, but if you take it regularly, you will develop some benzodiazepine dependence. If you were to quit at some point, your anxiety problems would return to what they were before treatment, but you can get additional withdrawal effects like a restless feeling or problems sleeping.
With opiates in general the problem is that you will develop tolerance to all of their properties, and will require higher dosages over time to achieve the same anxiolytic effect too.
edit: oh and btw, SSRIs are shit. Just my two cents.
I suppose anyone that has taken them for anxiety or mild depression will agree with that. Popping a a prozac may seem as normal as having a cup of coffee to some people, but i'd agree it definitely is not, and should not be the first course of treatment for anxiety at all. I'd almost say that the effect of starting on ssri's is worse then withdrawing from a mild to moderate benzo habit... with the added "bonus" of having to come off that ssri at some point in the future.
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Have you every gotten any treatment for you're anxiety? Therapy and antidepressants can help, I used to take paxil for anxiety, it worked wonders but I had to stop taking it cause it was killing my penis =/ lol. I take remeron now and it works pretty well.
Believe me though, self medicating for anxiety works well at first, but in the end it will only make you're anxiety problems worse, I guarantee it.
That is a bit contradictory though. If you seek medical help, you will be prescribed SSRI's, that will have its side effects on your sex life as you illustrated.
The only alternative is to self medicate, which you guarantee to worsen the problem.
Yes that's true SSRI's can have side effects but, but I tried a couple different ones and I found one that works great for me with no side effects. It doesn't hurt to try to get treatment, even if it doesn't work for you, at least you tried. But it does work for many people, myself included. If you don't want to try SSRI's or drugs, or if antidepressants don't work for you, you can try counseling, believe me it can help. If you don't have medical insurance and can't afford treatment, contact your local human services department, they can refer you too free or low cost mental health.
I guess all I'm saying is, at least think about getting some treatment, it might really help :) If you don't wanna try drugs that's fine, try some counseling.
(also, if you go to a doctor for anxiety problems, you're likely to get a benzo script also :D I don't recommend taking them if you got an addictive personality though, they are addictive as fuck to some people)
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Nobody likes to be mates with a junky.....
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I've never tried opiates nor benzos, but LSD makes it go away entirely for me. MDMA is also a given but unfortunately it's neurotoxic as hell.
I really resent the term "social anxiety" though. Just a buzzword to get people hooked on SSRI's. Exercise, a haircut and some nice new clothes will do more for your confidence than any substance will. In the long term anyway.
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I've noticed that methadone is one of the best opiates for social anxiety that is also less habit-forming than most other opiates. :)
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I really resent the term "social anxiety" though. Just a buzzword to get people hooked on SSRI's. Exercise, a haircut and some nice new clothes will do more for your confidence than any substance will. In the long term anyway.
+1 good sir. These are great words I think everyone should consider at least for a moment.
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Unless I missed a post I not sure I understand how bad your anxiety is. I make no judgments about people. In my very humble opinion using meds for emotional pain is just as valid as physical pain.
So I would say it depends.
How bad are your daily activities impaired by your anxiety?
I know some people can't get out of the house because of emotional distress just as pm folks like me can't get out of bed sometimes.
So if you are so disabled by your condition that you cannot function in life the I could understand why you soul look at other options when traditional treatment fails or is not available. I have seen opiates have a positive effect on depression. So I have no doubt it may help with anxiety.
I don't get your rational for the jump straight to h. Have you any experience at all with other opiates? From a harm reduction point of view would it not make more sense to use the least amount necessary to overcome your disability.
I know you said you have experience with other meds but opiates, while helpful under the right circumstances, are very different.
You just have to sit outside a methadone clinic to see how the addiction can lead to bigger problems.
This is not a judgement nor an attempt to scare or discourage you in anyway. I just want you to consider all benefits and risks to reach an informed decision.
Like I said. I could not function at all without my pain meds so I decided the benefits were worth the risks for me.
So the questions you will hopefully ask is: 1) Are my symptoms that bad? 2) What do I need as opposed to what do I want? 3) have I exhausted all other options.
Hope this helps you make an informed choice. Educate yourself and please be safe no matter what you decide.
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Drugs in general--fun and great but consider talk therapy(CBT) at least because it may be worth it.
So I finally gave up my struggle and went to seek the help of a therapist, and she cured me in less than a year.
I think people don't realize how much seeing a therapist can help depression or anxiety. You think, how is just going to talk with someone going to help my problem. So they never even try it. But surprisingly it helps a lot. Sometimes you have to try a couple different ones to find the right one for you, but when you do it helps so much.
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I use to use OC=OXYCONTIN..It took away any social anxiety and made me able to chit chat with anybody and i would talk for hours, plus it gave me allot of energy as long as i wasnt sitting stilll, then i would NOD out... Also Dillys=dalaudids worked great also.. I never could feel anything from Pervs,vics,loratabs or non of that weak bullshit cut with asprin... I went straight to Heavy shit.. Also mixing a OC and half a Xanax bar is goo..
I use to crush a 40mg down really fine then a part of a xanax bar reallt fine mix the powder together break it into 2 lines and sniff away, within 15 min i was ready to go!
My only sign was i would be extrmely talkitive and my eyes would be needle points.. Not to mention i would get pale.. Now iv started trying H, but not in social situations..
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Drugs in general--fun and great but consider talk therapy(CBT) at least because it may be worth it.
So I finally gave up my struggle and went to seek the help of a therapist, and she cured me in less than a year.
I think people don't realize how much seeing a therapist can help depression or anxiety. You think, how is just going to talk with someone going to help my problem. So they never even try it. But surprisingly it helps a lot. Sometimes you have to try a couple different ones to find the right one for you, but when you do it helps so much.
It is also a matter of mindset though. If you sincerely believe the only solution is to take some drug, it most likely is. The effects of psychotherapy depend on your feeling towards it, and if you dismiss it before giving it a serious try, chances are minimal it will have any beneficial effect.
Medication may have an effect that goes beyond its initial scope too though. If you experience anxiety in certain situations, and taking medication removes that feeling, you will get to know these situations as non-hostile. Sometimes this will take quite some time, on other occasions the effect is much faster. Just doing what you fear to do once or twice without feeling anxiety can sometimes permanently settle the idea that there is no danger permanently.