Silk Road forums

Discussion => Shipping => Topic started by: Meister on June 11, 2012, 02:43 pm

Title: Information on my seized shipment and testing for flagged address
Post by: Meister on June 11, 2012, 02:43 pm
I'm providing this information for several reasons, for information to be used by and improve our community, to answer some questions that have been asked but I have not seen confirmation of answers, and as a guide for those who aren't already informed on some points of this process.

I placed an order for 1oz of marijuana, through a reputable vendor who I had used in the past. This was a domestic USPS order. The shipment was taking longer than expected and after notifying the vendor he provided me with the DCN. According to the DCN, the package had never left the vendors city/state. It remained this way for 2 weeks.

*Note: There are some threads debating whether using TOR to check a DCN is advisable or not, I do not know for sure but I would lean on the side of it being fine to use TOR since they would not know whether it was the vendor or buyer checking the DCN if they are investigating it, and I doubt they flag any TOR users. For my uses, I used a VPN to check my DCN instead.

I had placed no other orders on SR after realizing the package was possibly seized, however I had already previously had a sample of moxy coming from Limetless, but it arrived intact, unopened during this time.

I contacted the vendor of this again, I was given a choice of either taking my losses or receiving a full refund but would never again be allowed to place an order with this vendor again. I obviously chose the refund, and then placed an order with a different vendor using a different address since I was obviously leery of using this address again.

At 2 weeks on the dot I received a notice slip in my mailbox from the mailman saying I had a 'large package' that I needed to either sign for or pickup at my local post office. I obviously wasn't going to pick this package up, but on further inspection of the slip I realized the 'Sender' field had 'Post. Insp.' written as the sender - so the package was re-labeled and resent by the Postal Inspector which I found amusing.

The next day I received the infamous 'love letter' letter from the Postal Inspector of the city/state the vendor is from. It said a package sent to my address was seized for suspicion of containing contraband which could be an illegal substance. It listed the vendors obviously fake name and return address and urged me to contact the Postal Inspector.

I cleaned house, removed all drugs, took my Tor USB and placed it in a safe place that would not be covered by a possible warrant to search my home, car etc. What I didn't do was freak out and fly onto this forum spreading unnecessary and non-factual fear with a series of threads offering little to no information to help anyone else in the same situation.

So up to this point what I believed happened is the Postal Inspector from the city/state of this vendor obviously knows shipments of marijuana are being sent through his facilities, and this vendor is a very large vendor so it's very possible they have stepped up their package inspection at these facilities because of this. Either way, the package was seized in the vendors city so the DCN was correct that the package never left there during these 2 weeks.

I believe the seized package was opened, the drugs removed, and possibly another letter was inserted into the package and it was sent on it's way. If they weren't doing a controlled delivery then I don't see a reason as to why they would send a fake drug substitute in it's place, which is why I assume the package resent by the Postal Inspector was either empty or contained another notification letter.

More time passed and I was reasonably assured this matter was not being pursued by my local authorities, so the next step was to verify if my address was now flagged to investigate suspicious packages or not.

What I then did was get a USPS Express package, I inserted a bag of potpourri which would feel similar to buds of marijuana, and then rubbed both the bag of potpourri in some bag of marijuana shake and then the outside of the Express package as well to ensure if a dog was used they would have to open it. I used paper around the potpourri to hide the contents as well.

I would need to know if they opened the package or not, since if they did and saw it was potpourri they would possibly reseal it and send it. I put 2 pieces of packing tape together and on the seam of these 2 pieces on both ends I made a very small X with a blacklight marker, and then another on the edge of the tape meeting the packaging. I did this on both ends of the package so that if it were opened, however carefully, these marks would not properly line up again and I would know it was opened.

I used a fake California return address, but shipped it from my state which is outside of California, this would raise more suspicions but that's what I was trying to achieve. The package arrived to my address unmolested, which leads me to believe that my address was not flagged. I've now shipped it again to a very close friend in New York who is going to immediately mail it back to me a second time just to be even more sure. This time instead of using a blacklight marker, I sliced an X in the tape in a few places with a razor knife so that if the tape was removed it tear.

So, from my experience I would advise anyone with a package that has not arrived in an extraordinary amount of time to check the DCN and monitor to see if it is sitting in one particular sorting facility where it was possibly seized. I've read many threads where a shipment never arrives and no 'love letter' is received either. I have noticed that many of these are non-domestic shipments, which leads me to believe that if they were seized then the customs for one of these countries has no authority to send a love letter. Of course it's also quite possible the package was simply lost, but my business sends out 25 or more packages daily to around the world and while we do have an occasional lost package, these are very few and far.
Title: Re: Information on my seized shipment and testing for flagged address
Post by: Meister on June 12, 2012, 12:44 pm
Also, I said I received the slip from the postman informing me the package (sent from the Postal Inspector) was available for me to pickup at my local post office. The note said that they would attempt to re-deliver the package, but they never did and never left another notice slip.

I feel the reason the package was seized in the first place is likely due to feeling the contents of the bag, I personally would pay extra for vendors to ship in boxes so that the marijuana isn't flattened but it also can't be squeezed to get an idea of the contents.
Title: Re: Information on my seized shipment and testing for flagged address
Post by: TreyWingo104 on June 12, 2012, 03:46 pm
first and foremost sorry to hear about losing the ounce but thank you so very much for going through all this trouble to shed some light by experimenting with our Master drug Traffickers, the USPS (haha).  Seriously though, thats cool as hell and a relief to hear there is no evidence yet (knocks on wood) of addresses being flagged.  Thats funny that they put frompostal inspector.  You should mail him a love letter from a fake return address and send him some sour dairy products included.  Tell him you seized his DNA and hate his life.  you the man :)
Title: Re: Information on my seized shipment and testing for flagged address
Post by: msft1 on June 13, 2012, 12:20 am
Wow, this is very helpful and thanks for not doing what most people do when they get a shipping issue (namely, come to the forums and spread their panic).
Title: Re: Information on my seized shipment and testing for flagged address
Post by: brutusk on June 13, 2012, 06:34 pm
+1 for an informative, well-written post. Thanks for the info.
Title: Re: Information on my seized shipment and testing for flagged address
Post by: Kappacino on June 13, 2012, 07:05 pm
It sounds like the vendor your purchased from needs to change their packaging.

Most likely their packaging/label size got profiled and therefore orders are being seized.
Title: Re: Information on my seized shipment and testing for flagged address
Post by: deadfuture on June 13, 2012, 07:14 pm
Great post.  Glad you did the right thing and kept calm.  I think you made all the right choices here, let us know if anything else develops.
Title: Re: Information on my seized shipment and testing for flagged address
Post by: Meister on June 13, 2012, 07:49 pm
It sounds like the vendor your purchased from needs to change their packaging.

Most likely their packaging/label size got profiled and therefore orders are being seized.

That's exactly what I thought, it's unfortunate that marijuana, the least harmful drug, is also one of the most difficult to ship undetected.
Title: Re: Information on my seized shipment and testing for flagged address
Post by: mooshroom on June 14, 2012, 04:10 pm
Flagging addresses that received contraband before might be entirely possible, just as filtering Tor users DCN, but it takes some time and effort and coordination to set up the whole thing, this is why I don't think they are doing it right now.
But since it's possible, it's better to check before acting on it, like you did Meister.
Thanks for the good post.
Title: Re: Information on my seized shipment and testing for flagged address
Post by: mooshroom on June 15, 2012, 12:04 am
Looks like so, for now...
Title: Re: Information on my seized shipment and testing for flagged address
Post by: ManaFromHeaven on June 15, 2012, 12:17 am
Well, written.  Thank you for your experience, it's so refreshing as.
+1
Title: Re: Information on my seized shipment and testing for flagged address
Post by: Delta11 on June 15, 2012, 12:25 am
Very well written, it only proves further that addresses don't seem to be getting flagged. The vendor must have messed up pretty badly if they detected the package because for the most part, domestic always seems to go through, it's international orders you should be paranoid about. Thanks again for writing the report!
Title: Re: Information on my seized shipment and testing for flagged address
Post by: Meister on June 15, 2012, 01:04 pm
Package should arrive from my friend today or tomorrow, just to use this as an opportunity for further testing I'm also checking the DCN several times using TOR to see if it flags the shipment.

This time instead of using a blacklight marker, I used a razor knife to cut an X into the tape in a few spots so if it's removed it will tear. He said the package reeks of potpourri, but I'm thinking that's a good thing as a masking scent should raise eyebrows as well.

I think if more people did this we would have a better idea of what we're up against, because it could possibly differ from one postal inspector to another, security measures differ from one sorting facility to another, hell it could even be the difference between getting a package handler that is pro-marijuana or anti-marijuana deciding whether to pull the package and report it or not.
Title: Re: Information on my seized shipment and testing for flagged address
Post by: PsilocybinTendencies on June 15, 2012, 02:08 pm
Thank you Meister for the very informative post! +1

I suppose I'm guilty of the fear mongering. But since there's now an answer to my question on the forums, I've removed my other topic.

What's startling about this is the fact that a domestic shipment got pegged. I haven't had had that one happen yet.
Title: Re: Information on my seized shipment and testing for flagged address
Post by: Michael25 on June 16, 2012, 07:04 am
I'm providing this information for several reasons, for information to be used by and improve our community, to answer some questions that have been asked but I have not seen confirmation of answers, and as a guide for those who aren't already informed on some points of this process.

I placed an order for 1oz of marijuana, through a reputable vendor who I had used in the past. This was a domestic USPS order. The shipment was taking longer than expected and after notifying the vendor he provided me with the DCN. According to the DCN, the package had never left the vendors city/state. It remained this way for 2 weeks.

*Note: There are some threads debating whether using TOR to check a DCN is advisable or not, I do not know for sure but I would lean on the side of it being fine to use TOR since they would not know whether it was the vendor or buyer checking the DCN if they are investigating it, and I doubt they flag any TOR users. For my uses, I used a VPN to check my DCN instead.

I had placed no other orders on SR after realizing the package was possibly seized, however I had already previously had a sample of moxy coming from Limetless, but it arrived intact, unopened during this time.

I contacted the vendor of this again, I was given a choice of either taking my losses or receiving a full refund but would never again be allowed to place an order with this vendor again. I obviously chose the refund, and then placed an order with a different vendor using a different address since I was obviously leery of using this address again.

At 2 weeks on the dot I received a notice slip in my mailbox from the mailman saying I had a 'large package' that I needed to either sign for or pickup at my local post office. I obviously wasn't going to pick this package up, but on further inspection of the slip I realized the 'Sender' field had 'Post. Insp.' written as the sender - so the package was re-labeled and resent by the Postal Inspector which I found amusing.

The next day I received the infamous 'love letter' letter from the Postal Inspector of the city/state the vendor is from. It said a package sent to my address was seized for suspicion of containing contraband which could be an illegal substance. It listed the vendors obviously fake name and return address and urged me to contact the Postal Inspector.

I cleaned house, removed all drugs, took my Tor USB and placed it in a safe place that would not be covered by a possible warrant to search my home, car etc. What I didn't do was freak out and fly onto this forum spreading unnecessary and non-factual fear with a series of threads offering little to no information to help anyone else in the same situation.

So up to this point what I believed happened is the Postal Inspector from the city/state of this vendor obviously knows shipments of marijuana are being sent through his facilities, and this vendor is a very large vendor so it's very possible they have stepped up their package inspection at these facilities because of this. Either way, the package was seized in the vendors city so the DCN was correct that the package never left there during these 2 weeks.

I believe the seized package was opened, the drugs removed, and possibly another letter was inserted into the package and it was sent on it's way. If they weren't doing a controlled delivery then I don't see a reason as to why they would send a fake drug substitute in it's place, which is why I assume the package resent by the Postal Inspector was either empty or contained another notification letter.

More time passed and I was reasonably assured this matter was not being pursued by my local authorities, so the next step was to verify if my address was now flagged to investigate suspicious packages or not.

What I then did was get a USPS Express package, I inserted a bag of potpourri which would feel similar to buds of marijuana, and then rubbed both the bag of potpourri in some bag of marijuana shake and then the outside of the Express package as well to ensure if a dog was used they would have to open it. I used paper around the potpourri to hide the contents as well.

I would need to know if they opened the package or not, since if they did and saw it was potpourri they would possibly reseal it and send it. I put 2 pieces of packing tape together and on the seam of these 2 pieces on both ends I made a very small X with a blacklight marker, and then another on the edge of the tape meeting the packaging. I did this on both ends of the package so that if it were opened, however carefully, these marks would not properly line up again and I would know it was opened.

I used a fake California return address, but shipped it from my state which is outside of California, this would raise more suspicions but that's what I was trying to achieve. The package arrived to my address unmolested, which leads me to believe that my address was not flagged. I've now shipped it again to a very close friend in New York who is going to immediately mail it back to me a second time just to be even more sure. This time instead of using a blacklight marker, I sliced an X in the tape in a few places with a razor knife so that if the tape was removed it tear.

So, from my experience I would advise anyone with a package that has not arrived in an extraordinary amount of time to check the DCN and monitor to see if it is sitting in one particular sorting facility where it was possibly seized. I've read many threads where a shipment never arrives and no 'love letter' is received either. I have noticed that many of these are non-domestic shipments, which leads me to believe that if they were seized then the customs for one of these countries has no authority to send a love letter. Of course it's also quite possible the package was simply lost, but my business sends out 25 or more packages daily to around the world and while we do have an occasional lost package, these are very few and far.

I believe this is the most susceptible part of the whole process. A vendor getting his wares out there. I could only imagine what some go through. Lets say a vendor has like 10-12 packages a day...it does get a little suspicious I guess and this is where the pros and amateurs differ I guess. How do these vendors keep shipping these products on a daily basis without raising suspicion?
Title: Re: Information on my seized shipment and testing for flagged address
Post by: mooshroom on June 16, 2012, 10:48 am
By changing drop off points, and posing as an Ebay seller?
Title: Re: Information on my seized shipment and testing for flagged address
Post by: puffmasterj on June 16, 2012, 04:05 pm
 Excellent post, I'm really glad you took the time to write this. Seriously, way to keep a cool and collected mindset while sorting through all this. Bravo, enjoy the rest of your weekend.
Title: Re: Information on my seized shipment and testing for flagged address
Post by: Meister on June 18, 2012, 02:33 pm
The package arrived from my friend in NY, intact and unopened, and I also received an 8th of actual weed as well, so at least in my case there seems to be no flagging of the address at all.

I received another notice from the mail carrier, saying the package is waiting for me at the local post office. I'm almost tempted to devise a plan to get the package just to see what it is, I'm assuming the oz of weed was replaced by another letter from the postal inspector explaining the contents were removed. As curious as I am, I won't take that unnecessary risk though.
Title: Re: Information on my seized shipment and testing for flagged address
Post by: brutusk on June 19, 2012, 03:18 am
The package arrived from my friend in NY, intact and unopened, and I also received an 8th of actual weed as well, so at least in my case there seems to be no flagging of the address at all.

I received another notice from the mail carrier, saying the package is waiting for me at the local post office. I'm almost tempted to devise a plan to get the package just to see what it is, I'm assuming the oz of weed was replaced by another letter from the postal inspector explaining the contents were removed. As curious as I am, I won't take that unnecessary risk though.

I would be tempted, too, but don't do it, nothing good can come if it.
Title: Re: Information on my seized shipment and testing for flagged address
Post by: zingzong on June 19, 2012, 09:47 pm
really good info, thanks for posting.
Title: Re: Information on my seized shipment and testing for flagged address
Post by: Nikodym on June 24, 2012, 06:10 am
Great post, clever thinking! I like it.
Title: Re: Information on my seized shipment and testing for flagged address
Post by: KAMALO006 on June 24, 2012, 08:00 am
Thank you Maester for your post
i think if every one here rely us his experience with customs will give a big help for our community !!
Proud to be a member of this beautifull community !!
Best regards from France
Title: Re: Information on my seized shipment and testing for flagged address
Post by: SteveyMcBobbyPants on June 25, 2012, 05:44 am
Thanks for posting this man. I wonder what it takes for LE to do a controlled delivery? I haven't heard of one of those happening in forever.
Title: Re: Information on my seized shipment and testing for flagged address
Post by: Chapman on September 19, 2012, 01:23 pm
I feel the reason the package was seized in the first place is likely due to feeling the contents of the bag, I personally would pay extra for vendors to ship in boxes so that the marijuana isn't flattened but it also can't be squeezed to get an idea of the contents.
{[I never order marijuana through here, so this will sound naiive I'm sure]}
There are hash vendors that ship in *bags*? Perhaps I'm just the paranoid type, but that sounds idiotic. Seems like the one thing that absolutely shouldn't be shipped in a bag.
Title: Re: Information on my seized shipment and testing for flagged address
Post by: fuckoffehbuddy on September 19, 2012, 01:51 pm
i don't think the post office has the resources to watch an address every single day for contraband and the way they treat their workers why would they give a fuck they never know when they will be laid off
Title: Re: Information on my seized shipment and testing for flagged address
Post by: TheSocialEngineerForumAcc on September 19, 2012, 02:02 pm
hell it could even be the difference between getting a package handler that is pro-marijuana or anti-marijuana deciding whether to pull the package and report it or not.

What if they were pro-marijuana and pro-stealing? Then theyd be the same as anti-marijuana handlers lol. Both types of package handlers would pull the package, its just one type would report it whereas the other type would smoke it themselves ;)
Title: Re: Information on my seized shipment and testing for flagged address
Post by: painbow on September 19, 2012, 05:41 pm
Very insightful information.

Any updates on your situation Meister?
Title: Re: Information on my seized shipment and testing for flagged address
Post by: newhorizen on September 20, 2012, 01:30 am
I've read many threads where a shipment never arrives and no 'love letter' is received either. I have noticed that many of these are non-domestic shipments, which leads me to believe that if they were seized then the customs for one of these countries has no authority to send a love letter. Of course it's also quite possible the package was simply lost, but my business sends out 25 or more packages daily to around the world and while we do have an occasional lost package, these are very few and far.

Another theory is customs does the "no LL" as a tactic to cause uncertainty about the vendor and create some fear to fight international vending.  The only way you are going to get flagged IMO, is if customs(or in the case of domestic-that originating LE agency) communicates directly with your local authorities or postal inspector where you are receiving your wares.  Otherwise it is too "thumbs up their ass" to sort through all packages at a major sorting facility for your name/address.  These guys are government employees they do not do any extra work especially if it is tedious work!
Title: Re: Information on my seized shipment and testing for flagged address
Post by: Easyrolling on September 20, 2012, 02:59 am
Very informative! Thanks!
Title: Re: Information on my seized shipment and testing for flagged address
Post by: psykhe on September 20, 2012, 09:13 am
Wonderful post, thanks for that Meister :)
Title: Re: Information on my seized shipment and testing for flagged address
Post by: joepinko on September 20, 2012, 03:59 pm
Excellent post, I'm really glad you took the time to write this. Seriously, way to keep a cool and collected mindset while sorting through all this. Bravo, enjoy the rest of your weekend.

The only person I knew who had it happen to them was having very large amounts of marijuana sent to them to Nor Cal. First and Foremost, this was not through SR and was occurring before SR got popular. Furthermore, the place the packages were being sent to is a pretty small town.

The CR was set and then the house was searched. People in the house owned up to what they had and I do not think they snitched. I personally had nothing to do with it, but it sucked to hear and see it. It was in the papers and shit