Silk Road forums
Discussion => Drug safety => Topic started by: Ben on October 06, 2012, 12:34 am
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Perhaps this is more of a question about efficacy then safety, but i didn't really know what other topic to post it under:
Do any of you have experiences taking 5-HTP as such? That is, not in combination with ssri's, mdma, carbidopa or something similar?
The scientific analysis of its effects are not very conclusive so far, but i'd be interested in experiences anyone had with it - as in how long and what dose did you take, and did you notice any effects, desired or adverse? Interest from the pharma industry has obviously been negligible since its a naturally occurring substance that cannot be patented, so no high quality studies are to be expected and i'm interested in personal experiences.
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I have been taking it as a daily supplement for around 6 months. I really can't say I notice any effects. I just take it in hopes it helps replace Seretonin lost while tripping.
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I took it a few times alone. And I've smoked weed on it plenty of times. The only thing I can say is you may or may not notice a slight mood change, nothing else. Of course, this is with a recommended dosage.
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If I recall correctly, 5-HTP is the metabolite of tryptophan, hence the boost to serotonin levels. I'm not sure if this is through re-uptake inhibition or some other process. I have taken it before and I found with consistent use, it can be helpful for insomnia and depression. Unfortunately, I can no longer take it due to being on an SSRI.
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The main difference between serotonin and 5-htp is that the former cannot pass the blood brain barrier, while the latter can. The onwards effects should be comparable where central nervous effects are concerned. Since 5-htp is sold as a food supplement i'm interested in any experiences people had with taking it.
With autumn setting in and winter coming, i've had some questions about its efficacy. In literature i can't really find any hard evidence one way or the other, so i'm curious about user experiences.
As far a combinations go: results combined with mdma or ssri's aren't much good, and the latter should never be produced in the first place. Interactions with alcohol, benzo's or cannabis probably aren't that severe to discard any effect observed outright though, so if you have any insights, please post them.
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I've taken 5-HTP and experienced mild hallucinogenic effects and nausea. 200 mg on an empty stomach.
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AFAIK you're receiving 5-HTP each time you drink milk. I guess that's why milk before going to bed helps you to sleep.
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I was taking 200mg of 5-HTP (slow release tablets) every morning for several months to help treat major depression (prior to getting a prescription for SSRIs).
I found this dose to be INCREDIBLY HELPFUL in treating the depression, although not as helpful as seeking psychological treatment, starting an SSRI (and a benzo for a little while), and removing the depression causing factors from my life.
Hope this is helpful!
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I'm somewhat lactose intolerant, so milk isn't a good idea for me. This isn't the question though - i'm not curious about the effects of tryptophane rich foods, but those of 5-htp specifically.
Some people seem to get some effect from ingesting it, while many experience no effect at all. This difference in experience is interesting, especially when coming from people that do not use substances that interfere with the serotonin system.
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I sometime take 200mg capsule of 5-HTP as a sleeping pill. Gives me faster sleep and somehow it's 'deeper': more dreams, longer sleep. Sideeffect is that I sometimes sleepy on the next day. It's good when you have no time for a long sleep, but if you're in bed for 9-10 hours you'll be definitely sleepy next day.
Works for me 100% same as melatonin (5-HTP is the precusor for melatonin), but melatonin pills give harsh effect. 5-HTP is smoother.
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The official line is that taking 5-HTP is a waste of time as it gets broken down by the liver before it has a chance to have any effect. I have taken it in the past and can't say I noticed much difference but when I tried it more recently it seemed to have a slightly depressing effect on my mood. Strange.
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5-HTP is indeed metabolized by the liver, but it seems not to be completely eliminated in the first pass, central effects on conditions like anxiety, depression and some types of ataxia have been demonstrated in placebo controlled double blind studies. This would indicate that some of it does reach the brain when ingested, even if most of it is metabolized on the first pass through the liver.
Curiously its marketed for a number of effects as a supplement:
- sleep aid
- anti depressant / mood stabilizer
- weight loss agent / appetite suppressor
I'm not really sure what to make if it myself - i've taken some (200mg tablets) just to see what it does (not on ssri's, so figured the chance of harm would be minute) and can't say i have noticed any remarkable effects on either health claim. No adverse effects either, though. Perhaps the effects would be more clear if combined with carbidopa, but i can't obtain that currently, not am i sure that using it has no negative effects.
As far as the effects of melatonin go: I've tried some of the supplement type tablets that contain a very small dose (0.1 mg each or so). Taking 10 of those had no noticeable effect at all, but perhaps it becomes more pronounced with larger doses. As far as I understand, however, taking larger doses of melatonin (say 5 or 10 mg) is not without dangers either since it does produce side effects like lasting drowsiness, headaches and even hypothermia in such amounts. Somehow that seems like a side effect profile worse then benzo's, making it hardly worth the effort where hypnotic effects are desired. If the anti depressant and weight loss claims come though as well it is still an interesting substance however, so i'm not ready to bunk it completely.
A mood depressing effect would be paradoxical, but that is not uncommon with any medication in that application - things like ssri's often have side effects that do the exact opposite of what you were taking them for (e.g. worsening anxiety, cause insomnia) for some period of time. Generally these adverse effects will diminish if you persist in taking the medication, i'm not sure if that would apply to 5-htp too though.
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I'd never checked out the claim regarding the role played by the liver but a quick google search has shown up a lot of interesting results regarding the positive effects of 5-HTP. I looked into melatonin years ago when I had some sleep issues but I never did anything about it.
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Post rolling it seems to help me out, also find a noticeable difference when I take it a day or two before rolling compared to when I don't. I seem to be able to not build any tolerance if I am rolling weekly while supplementing with 5HTP. Deeper sleeps, and VERY vivid dreams, I would say it would be helpful for lucid dreamers.
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Post rolling it seems to help me out, also find a noticeable difference when I take it a day or two before rolling compared to when I don't. I seem to be able to not build any tolerance if I am rolling weekly while supplementing with 5HTP. Deeper sleeps, and VERY vivid dreams, I would say it would be helpful for lucid dreamers.
Totally agree with you on the lucid dreamers part! I am a lucid dreamer and I can confirm that it helped me achieve more vivid dreams. It faded after a few days of taking it though. I usually will take it once ever few days and I have vivid dreams all the time. Really like 5-HTP.
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Improved recollection of dreams is an interesting effect too. I'm not sure i experienced that too, but cannot exclude it either.
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Can you snort or IM 5-htp?
:)
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I suppose there is not reason why you could not IV pure 5-HTP, but i've never seen it available as a pure substance. Most tablets containing it are derived from a plant source and will contain all kinds of contaminations. It's mostly marketed as a herbal supplement, probably because it's legal status as an effective medication has not been established. The latter is likely to be the result of a lack of research then of negative research results however. After all, it is a natural substance that cannot be patented, and hence of little importance to pharma companies regardless of efficacy.